Making a methyl cellulose solution

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btschumy
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Making a methyl cellulose solution

#1 Post by btschumy » Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:26 pm

I didn't want to pay Carolina Biological's high shipping cost for a bottle of their "Protoslo" solution. Instead I just bought some powdered methyl cellulose and thought I'd mix it myself.

Anyone have recipe for how much powder to how much water? If not, how thick should the resulting solution be. Is it a runny syrup-like consistensy?

Thanks,
Bill
Bill Tschumy
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zzffnn
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#2 Post by zzffnn » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:22 pm

Sorry, I cannot remember exactly nor do I use it enough to tell what a good final working concentration should be (I have used it only twice).

But my stock solution is 2% (2g in 100 ml of sterile water). So I would guess the final working concentration is around 1% or 0.5%, most likely 1%.

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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#3 Post by JimT » Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:20 pm

Btschumy, I have never used it but my guess is start very very diluted because if it is too thick it may interfere with the transparency of the slide sample. I read once that wallpaper paste is also a good thickener - again in a very diluted solution.

Keep us posted on your experiences.

JimT

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billben74
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#4 Post by billben74 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:10 pm

This doesn't answer the question I'm afraid but does have some information about using the stuff

http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/ind ... otech.html

But previous answers here are good advice.
I think when I used it I made it a little too thin/dilute, and then made a slightly thicker/concentrated version which slowed the little critters down nicely.

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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#5 Post by charlie g » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:34 pm

Hi, 1.5% is very useful. For live organisms to be slowed down by this viscosity tool...use it:50/50 by volume on a sample droplet.

I'm glad you are con-US...www.homesciencetools.com (Billings,Mt, phone: 800 860 6272 ) ships to private homes..visit their firm online..ready made vials of 1.5% methylcellulose are low cost.

Shipping fee is not high. A vial lasts years..just use a specific clean application technique: a clean needle probe dedicated solely for this substance application..never touch the water sample..let the viscous drops plop to the slide, immediately alcohol wipe the applicator needle probe and set it aside.

charlie guevara

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btschumy
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#6 Post by btschumy » Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:42 pm

Thanks for the link to homesciencetools.com. I wish they had come up in my web searches as using their premade solution would be easier than mixing my own.

Nevertheless, I have the powder and have figured out how to make an approx 1.5% solution despite not having an accurate scale for measuring. I will see how it goes.
Bill Tschumy
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#7 Post by btschumy » Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:05 pm

I got it mixed up last night. It takes some time for the methyl cellulose to dissolve so I waited until this morning to look at it. The solution is a bit thicker than I imagined. I'd say it is more like a thick syrup (think Karo corn syrup). I'm pretty sure I calculated the amounts correctly to yield a 1.5% solution (by weight).

Can someone that has the commercial 1.5% solution chime in on how thick it seems to them? If you squeeze out a drop, is it a pretty good sized one before dropping?

I haven't tried it yet on a slide (maybe tonight).
Bill Tschumy
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AO Spencer "Cycloptic" Stereo Microscope (Series 56C)

charlie g
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#8 Post by charlie g » Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:55 pm

Glad you achieved your 'batch'. As the physical viscosity is your concern...exactness of composition not critical..just keep it clean,,it will last for years if kept clean.

The viscosity is similar to thick maple syrup..not quite as thick as honey..a viscosity which permits a needle probe to literally carry enough out of a vial..and flow down the probe to a 'usual sized' water drop ( size of a drop of fluid from an eye-dropper'.

I,m sort of sure I have a thread with images in this forum called:'Methylcellulose viscosity tool'. Just search: charlie g threads.
Congrats on giving methylcellulose a try for live organisms..it works right up to water fleas. Flatworms are able to prowl out of it like ice-breakers on frozen waters!

charlie guevara

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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#9 Post by charlie g » Tue Jan 17, 2017 5:23 pm

Hi Bill and all...I just found this con-US firm in a search for live Volvox..thought it's methyl cellulose products relate to your thread here!

www.enasco.com their methylcellulose 1.5% sold in dropping bottles $3.55/100 for 30ml bottle, 100ml for $3.85/100.

This Wisconsin firm sells live cultures of all sorts, and other kit. charlie guevara

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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#10 Post by btschumy » Tue Jan 17, 2017 5:47 pm

Charlie,

Thanks for the link. I've found several sources for methyl cellulose solution. The product is generally inexpensive but the shipping will be twice the product cost. I just couldn't bring myself to do it. I haven't checked the shipping on your link though.

I ended up buying a bottle of powder on Amazon for $6. Now that I've figured out the amount to put in solution, I figure I easily have a lifetime supply. I only used 1/2 tsp in 50 ml of water. 50 ml should last a long time and that 1/2 tsp was about 1/75th of the bottle. As I said, it should last a lifetime.

I do find it can be a bit hard to get the right amount of MC on the slide. Too much and the cover slip floats too much. My current strategy is to put the MC on first (maybe a half-drop by touching the slide before the drop "drops") and spread it with a toothpick. Then I put the pond water on top, again, mixing with a toothpick if needed.

This seems to be working and I've now gotten some nice picts of protists.

Bill
Bill Tschumy
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einman
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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#11 Post by einman » Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:34 pm

Wihout going into detail there are posts to that effect Methocel comes in various grades and molecular weights so unless everyone is talking the same grade viscosities will vary.

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Re: Making a methyl cellulose solution

#12 Post by charlie g » Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:13 pm

Say, Bill, as the MC is a tool for active protists and meiofauna..no need for it with diatom hunts, algae in general hunts.

After a time..you have a sense of how large a drop of fluid to plop on a slide..and a size of fluid which permits a coverslip with no 'running/no overflow of the slide.

This is the same volume of total fluids (MC+sample fluids) you plop on a slide when using the MC viscosity tool.

Adding MC only after you've observed the slide (no cover slip yet) for organisms you wish to slow down for observations sake...ad MC 50/50 to a droplet of sample fluid.

Using rectangular coverslips (rather than the smaller square coverslips) offers much more room to roam with your tight working distance 40X and 60X dry-objectives..avoid the coverslip border areas with tight working distance objective!

charlie guevara

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