MicrobeHunter.com Microscopy Forum

You can also access this page with: www.microscopy-forum.com
It is currently Tue Aug 20, 2019 2:43 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 73 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 3 Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
There are many good Microscope manufacturers in China, they are all state-owned enterprises, established after 1949, They had good production experience and the quality of the products, but because of the lack of innovation and top microscope technology, They are development lags behind those of four big manufacturers, So most of the main business is the production of branded products, such as part of the Leica, Nikon products are made by manufacturers in China. Here are a overviews of some representative manufacturers:

MOTIC
http://www.motic.com/
The former Xiamen(location :Fujian province, east China) optical instrument factory, invested and built after the acquisition of Hong Kong capital in the 1990s, has established several processing bases in China, registered trademarks in many foreign countries, and become the world's fifth largest brand microscope.At present, MOTIC has strong strength in digital microscope and microdigital interaction. Recently, electric microscope has been introduced, because of the guarantee of system and capital investment, MOTIC is more invested in research and development than other domestic manufacturers, and some models such as metallographic microscope and inverted microscope are also good.In addition, its sales capacity is also obvious to all. Audi is arguably the first microscope brand in China.


Attachments:
捕获.JPG
捕获.JPG [ 106.28 KiB | Viewed 10621 times ]

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user


Last edited by redflanker on Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
NOVEL OPTICS
http://www.yxopt.com/
" NOVEL OPTICS ", "Jiangnan", and "NEXCOPE" : It is often called Jiangnan microscope in China (location :Nanjing ,Ningbo southeast of China)
Inheritance of Jiangnan photoelectric, has more than 60 years history is manufacturing experience of large-scale specialized microscope and photoelectric instrument manufacturers, in the 80s manufactured microscope objective lens and low-end microscope machine OEM production for LEICA, NIKON, also accumulated a lot of In the process and technology also accumulated a lot of experience, but the research and development investment is not large.


Attachments:
NOVEL.JPG
NOVEL.JPG [ 89.32 KiB | Viewed 10620 times ]

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user
Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
Shanghai Optical Instrument Factory
http://www.optical-sh.com/
Established in 1978, (location :Shanghai,China),Shanghai optical instrument factory is one of the most powerful old optical factories in China. It produces a series of microscopes, including biological, stereoscopic, metallographic, inverted and fluorescence, among which biological, metallographic and polarizing microscopes are leading in China, and some types of stereoscopic microscopes are good.As a result of paying attention to the quality of products and after-sales services, sales market gradually expanded, in the field of optics showed a rising trend.


Attachments:
上海光学.JPG
上海光学.JPG [ 178.74 KiB | Viewed 10620 times ]

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user
Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:15 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
Phenix Optics
http://www.phenixoptics.com.cn/
(location :Jiangxi province, Southeast China)The manufacture transformed from military industry into a civilian company,was founded in 1965.Phoenix camera is a well-known brand in China. Its main business includes optical lens, battery cell, photographic equipment and optical instrument. Phoenix microscope only a small part of phoenix optics. Some models are excellent, but others are of average quality.


Attachments:
凤凰.JPG
凤凰.JPG [ 147.17 KiB | Viewed 10620 times ]

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user
Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 3:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 28, 2017 11:23 pm
Posts: 325
Interesting


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 3:52 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2017 8:24 am
Posts: 1336
Location: NorthWest England
A very useful overview ... Thanks

MichaelG.

_________________
Too many 'projects'


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:02 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:03 pm
Posts: 63
Good to know more brands, but using "review" in the title is a bit confusing. I had expected more than an overview of the companies.

mnmyco


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:22 am
Posts: 566
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Thanks.

A few questions, if I might:

- Is Motic #5 in terms of units or microscope revenue? I've heard that Meiji might have more revenue???

- Would you know if any of these suppliers have an affordable DIC (Nomarski) prisms and microscopes?

- Any comments or rank ordering of the following:

-- Ningbo Sunny Instruments Co, Ltd.;
-- Nanjing Jiangnan Novel Optics co. Ltd (Novel);
-- Chongqing Optec Instrument Co, Ltd. (Optec);
-- Guilin Guiguang Instrument Co., Ltd. (GLO);
-- Guangzhou, Guangdong Optical Instrument Co, Ltd (Lissview etc.) and
-- Chongqing COIC Industrial Co, Ltd.
-- others??

- Would you happen to know which of the Leica microscopes are made by Phenix? I've heard it's just the low-end "BME" model?

- Can you say a bit more about Shanghai Optical Instrument Factory? I didn't know it might be one of the top three or four Chinese makes. Is it producing mostly for the domestic market or export as well?

Many thanks if you can add any further details; as I'm compiling a list of microscope models and brands available (and affordable) to hobbyists and would like to update it.


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri May 15, 2015 12:15 am
Posts: 2639
One of the problems with including Chinese manufacturers in any list of manufacturers is that the business model in China is very different, due to the planned economy. This means that most of the manufacturers are assemblers, rather than O.E. manufacturers. It is much more efficient for the objectives for instance, to be made in one or two dedicated factories, which supply the assemblers. Optical choices are dictated mostly by how many units of production are necessary to justify a manufacturing run and therefore a parts supply and most of the formulas have been pilfered. You will sometimes see the same microscope with an entirely different set of optics for a subsequent production. They may be the same or similar internally but externally, they were what was available at the time of production. The optics almost never have a manufacturers name on them because that could change in a flash. Motic seems to be a little different in this. They are the one company that seems to be on a course of development to catch up with the biggies. They of them all, may manufacture more of their components in house or at least contract out with O.E. specifications in hand, rather than buy off the shelf.


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:06 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:22 am
Posts: 566
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Good point, Phil. Right now Motic (which now sells mainly under its own brand) is the only Chinese maker I have listed. Phenix gets a mention for the Leica BME. The others end up supplying the AmScopes, Omaxes, Premieres, etc. etc. of the world - stenciled on brands with more or less QC and support.

US lab supply used to procure their house brands from various Japanese makers -- now it's mainly Chinese (who now supply about half the world's microscopes by unit volume -- mostly at the low and mid range).


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:07 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
PeteM wrote:
Thanks.

A few questions, if I might:

- Is Motic #5 in terms of units or microscope revenue? I've heard that Meiji might have more revenue???

- Would you know if any of these suppliers have an affordable DIC (Nomarski) prisms and microscopes?

- Any comments or rank ordering of the following:

-- Ningbo Sunny Instruments Co, Ltd.;
-- Nanjing Jiangnan Novel Optics co. Ltd (Novel);
-- Chongqing Optec Instrument Co, Ltd. (Optec);
-- Guilin Guiguang Instrument Co., Ltd. (GLO);
-- Guangzhou, Guangdong Optical Instrument Co, Ltd (Lissview etc.) and
-- Chongqing COIC Industrial Co, Ltd.
-- others??

- Would you happen to know which of the Leica microscopes are made by Phenix? I've heard it's just the low-end "BME" model?

- Can you say a bit more about Shanghai Optical Instrument Factory? I didn't know it might be one of the top three or four Chinese makes. Is it producing mostly for the domestic market or export as well?

Many thanks if you can add any further details; as I'm compiling a list of microscope models and brands available (and affordable) to hobbyists and would like to update it.


Motic declare they are 5th microscope manufactor of the world,and they has selling many microscope in europe,so I thought Motic might more revenue,but the price of MOTIC much more expensive than other Chinese microscope,in personal retail market of China,people prefer Jiangnan microscope,consider the quality and price

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
apochronaut wrote:
One of the problems with including Chinese manufacturers in any list of manufacturers is that the business model in China is very different, due to the planned economy. This means that most of the manufacturers are assemblers, rather than O.E. manufacturers. It is much more efficient for the objectives for instance, to be made in one or two dedicated factories, which supply the assemblers. Optical choices are dictated mostly by how many units of production are necessary to justify a manufacturing run and therefore a parts supply and most of the formulas have been pilfered. You will sometimes see the same microscope with an entirely different set of optics for a subsequent production. They may be the same or similar internally but externally, they were what was available at the time of production. The optics almost never have a manufacturers name on them because that could change in a flash. Motic seems to be a little different in this. They are the one company that seems to be on a course of development to catch up with the biggies. They of them all, may manufacture more of their components in house or at least contract out with O.E. specifications in hand, rather than buy off the shelf.


agreement,MOTIC is the best companies of development in chinese manufactor,Because a lot of capital injection, and successfully expanded foreign markets.but I'm going to point out one thing that almost all state-run manufactor in China have converted into a public-private partnership after economic revolution in 1980, planned economy is ending in all industry except military and few Lifeblood industries. The government now is just shareholding but not Participate in operation,there are many Private capital investment even oversea investment in this company. I think they produce more OEM products should due to low brand awareness and lack of top technology.

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:03 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
PeteM wrote:
Good point, Phil. Right now Motic (which now sells mainly under its own brand) is the only Chinese maker I have listed. Phenix gets a mention for the Leica BME. The others end up supplying the AmScopes, Omaxes, Premieres, etc. etc. of the world - stenciled on brands with more or less QC and support.

US lab supply used to procure their house brands from various Japanese makers -- now it's mainly Chinese (who now supply about half the world's microscopes by unit volume -- mostly at the low and mid range).


The same as chinese market, Japanese microscope is still most Competitive microscope supplier in China now, Especially in hospitals and research units, Olympus and Nikon has their factory in CHINA, but It looks like the quality has gone down a little bit.

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user


Top
   
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:37 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:15 am
Posts: 45
Thanks redflanker, just per curiosity, how much cost in China a Motic a stereo zoom with CMO and zoom objectives? It's only to compare. THANKS


Top
   
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 6:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 37
Location: Kunming,China
Tarloth wrote:
Thanks redflanker, just per curiosity, how much cost in China a Motic a stereo zoom with CMO and zoom objectives? It's only to compare. THANKS

This is the price of the Motic company's official store on taobao,1¥=0.1441$,so,it‘s about 979.88USD for a brand new Motic stereo microscope


Attachments:
motic.JPG
motic.JPG [ 103.1 KiB | Viewed 10362 times ]

_________________
Microscope:Zeiss Primo star with phase contrast
Camera:Cannon 600D
Amateur user
Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 12:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:15 am
Posts: 45
Thanks, but which model is it? I like to view the specs, thanks


Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:26 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm
Posts: 310
This might be too much to ask, but do you know who makes the Scienscope E-series microscopes, like this one?
Image
They are a somewhat impressive take on the Nikon SMZ scopes, which is compatible with at least the SMZ10 (though the head not with the smz1500, at least not fully, though the objective is compatible). I am not sure if these are the same ones from Novel, which I think Amscope also resells(?) like this one.
I kind of wonder if they're the ones making a lot of the stereo scopes, since their website lists a lot of familiar-looking examples? I also wonder if there's any direct relationship to the Nikon SMZ scopes, or if they're just made to be compatible.
Sorry for the oddly specific questions, I recently got one of the 10:1 zoom ratio stereo scopes, and aside from some issues with the head (which isn't designed for easy servicing) it's a pretty impressive scope.


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 3:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:44 am
Posts: 37
Thanks for the leg work. It's good to know which brands to avoid like the plague. Hint: I seriously dislike success based on reverse engineering and the like.


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:01 pm
Posts: 2872
Thanks for posting all of this.. It was noted a few years ago that the so called "big four" had moved production to China.... Old die hards don't like to hear it...

https://microscopetalk.wordpress.com/mi ... -in-china/

This is common practice world wide.... Get used to it... And don't let anyone tell you that it is only the "low end" microscopes that are Chinese made.. There is nothing cheap about a Nikon Eclipse TS100 Inverted Chinese made microscope.. How about $3290 as a "cheap" one. that is also "fully refurbished", meaning it is used..

https://www.marshallscientific.com/Niko ... -ts100.htm

BillT


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri May 15, 2015 12:15 am
Posts: 2639
To clarify that somewhat. ........Actually, the remaining name brands of microscope manufacturers use China as a source for their bottom of the barrel production, so they can duke it out for the educational and small lab markets: or any customer with a small budget. Confusing the issue promoting a misconception that they have moved production there is misleading.
Even if it did take place , due to market competition, that one of the big 4 moved manufacturing lock stock and barrel to a foreign country, it would be simply to take advantage of a cheap labour force . The design and engineering would still be centered at the home office.
There is no doubt that if Motic or any of the better Chinese producers wanted to , they could produce a better class of scope than the bargain basement stuff usually discounted on line but in order to produce a silk purse, a sow's ear would unlikely to be used and the price would reflect that; It already does in the case of Motic and they have priced themselves quite above the fray of the discounted stuff made from recycled pop cans .
They and a few other actual brands, that are Chinese brands that are not stencil manufacturers, do have a real possibility of upping the quality and recognition of their name and being held in some regard but in order to do that, they need to separate themselves quite distantly from the bulk of the dismal garbage that finds it's way into e commerce.
That would be a long road. If they went head to head with Olympus say, they wouldn't be that much cheaper and for sure it would be a long time before they could match them nose to nose in sophistication of technology, all the while suffering from the stigma of inferiority. They would be expected to be much cheaper, not just some cheaper, something that increasingly grows less possible as the Chinese economy grows.


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 6:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:01 pm
Posts: 2872
"The design and engineering would still be centered at the home office."

This does not determine the quality of the finished product.. I know you are in anguish over your pet brands being Chinese made, but it is true.. Get used to it.. No amount of babble and techno babble will change it.. Write a letter to you favorite "big four" and scold them about taking advantage of Chinese manufacture.. You can ramble on endlessly here and put everyone to sleep, but you will change nothing...

Regards,
BillT


Top
   
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:17 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:33 am
Posts: 279
Location: Brisbane Aust
Like in many spheres now, the only guarantee of overall quality is to buy a used product from a former era.


Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:44 am
Posts: 37
coominya wrote:
Like in many spheres now, the only guarantee of overall quality is to buy a used product from a former era.


Yes. This is exactly what I am doing. Even if it requires tedious work hunting down parts needed.

As mentioned I also seriously dislike reverse engineering and the like - it is stealing intellectual property. There's no way to sugarcoat it.


Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 11:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 5:17 pm
Posts: 9
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Maybe this is why I own 4 AOs, 2 Leitz and 2 Zeiss. I cant get over how much microscope you can buy for about $100.

Gerard


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 7:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:58 pm
Posts: 269
Location: Northern Germany
Seems to me to be a lot of equipment snobbery going on here.
Lots of major manufacturers have their products made in China not just microscopes and this has been the case for many years now.
I was advised to check my Sony camera was made in Japan and not China when I bought it 5 Years ago for 650 Euro (still going strong). It was of course manufactured in China is still manufactured today and sells for 350 euro. The latest variation is now up to MK5.

_________________
Alan
Bresser Science Infinity 4x 10x 40x 60x 100x oil. Canon EOS 4000d


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 10:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:01 pm
Posts: 2872
It has always been that way here, Roldorf.. Just ignore the downers and buy what YOU prefer..

BillT


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 11:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri May 15, 2015 12:15 am
Posts: 2639
Roldorf wrote:
Seems to me to be a lot of equipment snobbery going on here.
Lots of major manufacturers have their products made in China not just microscopes and this has been the case for many years now.
I was advised to check my Sony camera was made in Japan and not China when I bought it 5 Years ago for 650 Euro (still going strong). It was of course manufactured in China is still manufactured today and sells for 350 euro. The latest variation is now up to MK5.



Don't mistake a qualified opinion for an opinion, Roldorf. Yes, China is perfectly capable of manufacturing a piece of equipment made to whatever specification that is required, within the technical realm of their society. A Sony camera for 650.00 Euros, because Sony put the possibility on a platter for them, or the equipment to land on the other side of the moon. If a camera claimed similar specifications as your Sony but just happened to be called a Seagull , was 1/2 the price and only available on the internet would you have considered it in the same breath as your Sony?

The key point is the term "whatever specification that is required". In the case of the majority of internet hawked Chinese microscopes, those specifications are quite mediocre, with some they are unwilling to reveal, concealed and some others that are completely ubiquitous, overinflated by hyperbolae. It is usually the price that attracts the new buyer, that and fear of the unknown that a used quality brand might bring.
Like with everything else, consumers who don't really know anything about what they are buying are very vulnerable to marketing strategy and afraid that they are going to get taken, if they buy something used. That is always possible, so asking questions and relying on advice from a place like this forum can help. Getting taken dosn't just exist at the used goods level though. It happens all the time with new goods . Cheap is cheap. You get what you pay for.


Last edited by apochronaut on Mon May 06, 2019 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
   
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 3:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:01 pm
Posts: 2872
.


Last edited by billbillt on Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
   
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 5:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:55 am
Posts: 948
Location: Arnold, Missouri USA
Not really sure I have a dog in this fight.
Before I started collecting microscopes, and began to find the opportunities that go with it, I bought a Chinese student microscope which I learned to take pictures through.
I used it quite a bit. Learned a lot about filters and illumination with it.

Right now all of my microscopes are “used” classic microscopes.

If I were purchasing my first microscope, I wouldn’t hesitate to get a basic Chinese microscope to start with. Learn all I could using it, until I decided which aspect of the hobby appealed to me the most and then look for a scope with the features I need to go there.

The downside I see with Chinese microscopes is the availability of service and repair.
At this price point, I guess you can throw it away and buy another one.

My point is don’t buy something you won’t use. Also, don’t let one gimmick be the bait that gets you something really sub-standard.

As always, if the deal sounds too good to be true, it almost certainly is. Make sure you get glass optics.

Just my two cents,
Radazz

_________________
Arnold, Missouri
Olympus IX70 HMC
Olympus BX40 Phase Contrast
Olympus SZ40 Stereoscope


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 6:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm
Posts: 310
I have looked through a few chinese stereo microscopes that I liked and a few that didn't do much for me. My local microscope repair guy (Microscope Solutions) is an accu-scope/unitron dealer (among others) and I occasionally look through them when I'm there. For instance I thought their "z730" (which you can see under various names from different resellers) was a quite credible take on a nikon smz-1. I would not recommend paying 800 bucks for it (why not just get four used smz1s), but nevertheless it is a perfectly nice low mag stereo. I also have one of the smz series clones I mentioned a few posts back, and I have been favorably impressed by it overall. Again I wouldn't recommend buying one new, but I think if one did they would at least have a nice and usable piece of equipment. That being said, neither of these are low end or cheap, except relative to a new name brand scope (and even then, some like the Unitron z12 get priced so high you might as well buy a new Nikon.)
On the other hand my first stereo, an amscope meji-lookalile, was functional but unexciting. I have also tried out the gemological isntitute of america's self-branded stereo head (an olympus lookalike iirc) and I thought the CA was just too prominent (though that may have partially been the subject, a diamond, combined with bright led darkfield illumination).
I don't have any conclusion to that, I guess, just a few experiences.


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 73 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 3 Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited