New Scope/Phase Contrast Question

[cash]

Hello, I’m planning to purchase a compound scope and have used them enough in life science courses to be fairly familiar with features and function. Primary uses for me would include viewing bryophyte (moss) thin sections and fungal spores but also looking at the occasional “protist” or prokaryote.

Staining sections isn’t a big problem for vegetative specimens. But for other microbiology applications (esp. involving motile organisms) it seems like there’s little point in considering a scope without phase contrast (and I’d welcome input from anyone who thinks I’m mistaken). I’m hoping to stay within the $1,500 range for a triocular and an inexpensive camera. And while I enjoy reading about the used and refurbished scopes on this site, I’d prefer an out-of-the box usable scope even at the expense of superior optics for lower cost. I just don’t want to deal with potential concerns about the condition of what I’m getting or its compatibility with other components and would prefer to have the scope up and running quickly.

My question is this: given these considerations, will a lower range Amscope (or something similar) with a phase contrast kit be good enough for this sort of non-professional use and the occasional photo or will I likely regret not moving up to a higher price point and better class of scopes due to substandard performance of the PC objectives? Some Amscopes labeled for “vet clinic laboratory” use are priced ranging from $700 to $1,200 and include phase contrast kits. The more expensive ones in this range have a “turret” arrangement that I assume allows for easier switchover of objectives from brightfield to PC.

Thanks much for any advice.
David

[bphuber]

The turret style of phase contrast condenser is MUCH easier to use than the ones that require replacing the phase condenser each time you change objectives. But, if you are using the same objective constantly, then you can save some money.
When buying used, you will need to pay attention to the type of optical system used. Older scopes used fixed tube length (160, 170, 210) for example. Newer mainline (Olympus, Nikon, etc.) scopes use infinity corrected optical systems and the two systems are not compatible optically.
You can buy some decent sets of phase contrast (Lomo, Fisher) used on ebay for less than $300. New sets from AmScope are ~$700. Both of these I've seen are 160 tube length, AmScope is still 160. AmScope and others still make scopes with 160 tube length. Just pay attention to the offerings.

[desertrat]

Old AO-Spencer 160mm tube length phase systems show up on Ebay occasionally, but not as often as more recent types. They have a very nice turret condenser. Once in awhile one goes for auction at a pretty low price. About 8 or 9 years ago I was very lucky and in the space of a couple of months was able to put together a complete 4 Series Phasestar system from two incomplete units for a total cost of about $75. Shipping probably pushed the total cost to a little over $100.

I guess most people probably don't want to take a chance on something quite as old, and probably needing cleaning, lubrication, and adjustment.

[PeteM]

A new or near new Amscope, AccuScope, Omax etc. phase contrast infinity trinocular should do fine and under the $1500 mark. Do get the Zernicke type phase condenser, a trinocular head, and likely plan phase objectives. I'd aim for infinity rather than finite optics as well. One I had (and sold for half that in near new condition) was an AccuScope and it provided very good plan phase and brightfield images.

Recognize, though, that there's not much of an upgrade path beyond this. You can start with plan phase achromats. But the Chinese plan fluorites aren't a big step up -- despite costing a great deal more -- than something like an Olympus Plan Achromat phase objectives. And Apo versions don't seem to be available for these scopes, much less options like reflected light or DIC. The moral of this story being that something like a new Amscope will get you quickly started -- which is what you want -- but also might have you selling it and starting again if you later get a hankering for really good objectives or other options. One nice thing about some of the higher end infinity Chinese scopes is that some of them seem to copy Olympus standards for heads and (perhaps) phase rings. Gives you a bit of mix and match possibilities for future upgrades.

[Hobbyst46]

Hello, I’m planning to purchase a compound scope and have used them enough in life science courses to be fairly familiar with features and function. Primary uses for me would include viewing bryophyte (moss) thin sections and fungal spores but also looking at the occasional “protist” or prokaryote.
I’m hoping to stay within the $1,500 range for a triocular and an inexpensive camera.
And while I enjoy reading about the used and refurbished scopes on this site, I’d prefer an out-of-the box usable scope even at the expense of superior optics for lower cost. I just don’t want to deal with potential concerns about the condition of what I’m getting or its compatibility with other components and would prefer to have the scope up and running quickly.

My question is this: given these considerations, will a lower range Amscope (or something similar) with a phase contrast kit be good enough for this sort of non-professional use and the occasional photo or will I likely regret not moving up to a higher price point and better class of scopes due to substandard performance of the PC objectives? Some Amscopes labeled for “vet clinic laboratory” use are priced ranging from $700 to $1,200 and include phase contrast kits. The more expensive ones in this range have a “turret” arrangement that I assume allows for easier switchover of objectives from brightfield to PC....
David

hi,
Assuming that you opt for a new microscope, the only unknown in your clear description of the subject is: which performance level is acceptable and justifies the price. The best way to clarify this point, unforetunately, is to test the microscope in person before buying. Have some test slides ready. I would prepare, or borrow from a colleague, or buy some good-quality prepared slides. For example, a histology sample (will be stained, so too demanding test specimens for brightfield); a cheek-cell slide; a slide of other fixed animal cells; those latter two are colorless specimens, so they are suitable test slides for phase contrast. Take these slides to the offered microscope and inspect them. Handle and feel the mechanics of the scope, observe the illumination intensity etc. After such experience, the $1200 expenditure will seem reasonable (if the results are positive).
BTW, a simple digital camera for a microscope can cost as little as $50-100, with decent to fine performance.
If you cannot perform such tests in person, ask the vendor to provide example photos of slides that indicate not only that the brightfield is fine, but also that the phase contrast is good.
I think that 3-4 phase contrast objectives - say 4X, 10X, 20X, 40X - should be included. As others have commented, go for a turret condenser that provides BF and PC. I would also buy a darkfield condenser - it is a must IMHO. The scope head should be trinocular, not binocular, and come with wide field eyepieces with a high eyepoint.
I would try and purchase a complete setup, rather than build on future upgrades.

[cash]

Thanks so much for all the excellent advice. It's extremely helpful and has provided exactly the clarification I needed.

[cash]

Hello, I’m planning to purchase a compound scope and have used them enough in life science courses to be fairly familiar with features and function. Primary uses for me would include viewing bryophyte (moss) thin sections and fungal spores but also looking at the occasional “protist” or prokaryote.
I’m hoping to stay within the $1,500 range for a triocular and an inexpensive camera.
And while I enjoy reading about the used and refurbished scopes on this site, I’d prefer an out-of-the box usable scope even at the expense of superior optics for lower cost. I just don’t want to deal with potential concerns about the condition of what I’m getting or its compatibility with other components and would prefer to have the scope up and running quickly.

My question is this: given these considerations, will a lower range Amscope (or something similar) with a phase contrast kit be good enough for this sort of non-professional use and the occasional photo or will I likely regret not moving up to a higher price point and better class of scopes due to substandard performance of the PC objectives? Some Amscopes labeled for “vet clinic laboratory” use are priced ranging from $700 to $1,200 and include phase contrast kits. The more expensive ones in this range have a “turret” arrangement that I assume allows for easier switchover of objectives from brightfield to PC....
David

hi,
Assuming that you opt for a new microscope, the only unknown in your clear description of the subject is: which performance level is acceptable and justifies the price. The best way to clarify this point, unforetunately, is to test the microscope in person before buying. Have some test slides ready. I would prepare, or borrow from a colleague, or buy some good-quality prepared slides. For example, a histology sample (will be stained, so too demanding test specimens for brightfield); a cheek-cell slide; a slide of other fixed animal cells; those latter two are colorless specimens, so they are suitable test slides for phase contrast. Take these slides to the offered microscope and inspect them. Handle and feel the mechanics of the scope, observe the illumination intensity etc. After such experience, the $1200 expenditure will seem reasonable (if the results are positive).
BTW, a simple digital camera for a microscope can cost as little as $50-100, with decent to fine performance.
If you cannot perform such tests in person, ask the vendor to provide example photos of slides that indicate not only that the brightfield is fine, but also that the phase contrast is good.
I think that 3-4 phase contrast objectives - say 4X, 10X, 20X, 40X - should be included. As others have commented, go for a turret condenser that provides BF and PC. I would also buy a darkfield condenser - it is a must IMHO. The scope head should be trinocular, not binocular, and come with wide field eyepieces with a high eyepoint.
I would try and purchase a complete setup, rather than build on future upgrades.

I have ready access to prepared slides, so thanks for suggesting some test runs. I'll see what I can do. Thanks also for your comment re darkfield. I've made good use of it in biological applications and so will be sure it's included in whatever I end up purchasing.