Want to buy new compound microscope

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micro
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Want to buy new compound microscope

#1 Post by micro » Tue Apr 07, 2020 2:54 am

I want to get a better microscope. I have a cheap $220 swift microscope and now I want to upgrade to something in the 1k range or so with plan/infinity objectives, phase contrast etc. I want to use it for taking videos of protozoa and such so it needs to be trinocular so I can use a dslr camera. Most of the 1k range microscopes all seem to be generally the same and I can't tell if one is better than the other.

I would like to order it from amazon or a reputable site. The motic is from microscope.com but idk how legit that is.

These all seem good but maybe someone can recommend something better or which is best?

https://www.google.com/shopping/product ... HcQ8wIIgQM

https://www.amscope.com/40x-2500x-profe ... lsrc=aw.ds

https://www.amazon.com/Omano-OM159T-Tri ... s9dHJ1ZQ==

PeteM
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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#2 Post by PeteM » Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:08 am

This is a common question and you might want to search some of the earlier posts.

Generally speaking, if you take the time to carefully select a used microscope, you'll get 2x the scope for your money. If buying new, your idea of buying from Amazon is a good one.

Of the scopes you've listed, looks like only the AmScope 690 series has both phase contrast and a trinocular head. I've had one of their phase sets (put them on an Olympus BX40 to try) and they were OK - not quite to Olympus standards. With tax and shipping you'll probably be in the $1600 range and still have to hook up your camera.

The same company now owns both the AmScope and Omax brands. Motic is one of the larger Chinese makers. All three models, pretty sure, are made in China.

Good luck. The 690 is OK if you prefer to buy new. If you want to consider used, you can message me for the guide to various brands and models we use to help parents and mentors find a good scope.

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#3 Post by micro » Tue Apr 07, 2020 4:23 am

I was trying to use the search bar but it kept saying words like microscope and buy were too often used lol

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#4 Post by micro » Tue Apr 07, 2020 4:37 am

I swear to god the olympus and zeiss websites could not be less new user friendly

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#5 Post by 75RR » Tue Apr 07, 2020 5:40 am

I swear to god the olympus and zeiss websites could not be less new user friendly
They are geared to institutional sales.

Have a look at this article - it might help

http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/art ... oscope.pdf
Zeiss Standard WL (somewhat fashion challenged) & Wild M8
Olympus E-P2 (Micro Four Thirds Camera)

dtsh
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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#6 Post by dtsh » Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:08 pm

I just went through a somewhat similar instance where I was looking to spend around $1000 for a stereomicroscope, I had reviewed a number of models and had a selection of about 6 I figured were reasonable candidates. I reached out to the community for advice on selecting, as I had no direct experience with any of them, and I got some very valuable input. A few models I had overlooked were suggested with various features I had not considered and it greatly assisted my final selection.

With that kind of budget I personally would be looking at something like an Olympus BH2 series scope or perhaps an AO Microstar IV. I have a BH1 and I'm pretty happy with it, the BH2 is a refinement with more options. I think it's very useful to study the manuals/literature for any scope you are considering and to ask pointed questions here as there's a good chance someone here has hands-on experience with any particular model. Think about what your current scope doesn't do and what you want from the new one.

My reasoning for suggesting these is multi-faceted; they are plentiful, which helps to keep the costs lower. There are a number of readily available options such as objctives, condensers, etc to fit pretty much any need; as I understand it there's even a DIC setup for either (though apparently it's not especially common). This gives a person the opportunity to get a high quality scope with the desired options for less than a comparable new scope. Admittedly, there is some risk in buying a used instrument, but I think a lot of that risk can be mittigated by being a discerning buyer, by educating yourself beforehand on the features, operation, and performance so you can better evaluate a unit upon arrival and return it immediately if it isn't 100% as described.

The sheer number of these units available should make finding one in good serviceable condition with all or at least the majority of your desired accessories fairly easy. I don't see you being able to reach the same level of quality and preformance in a new scope in anywhere near the same price range as used would allow. You may even find one which is available from a member who can ensure they are sending a fine instrument.

I think if you ask for suggestions about what would preform the tasks you expect that you will get a number of suggestions to check into and probably a number of questions you never thought to ask (and may not have an answer for) to help guide you toward the best fit for your needs.

Initially I wanted to focus on instruments with a trinocular to allow for the utility of a camera, but for my uses (my uses and yours may not be alike) it added extra complication that limited my selection while not actually providing me with much added utility as imaging isn't a primary requirement for me. I still take photos from time to time, but I do it afocally (camera at the eyepiece). I hope that helps.

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#7 Post by micro » Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:21 pm

I don't think I'm going to go the used route because I don't want to risk getting something bad but I couldn't really find much anyways on ebay and such. @dtsh I am going to be taking videos so it has to be trinocular.
If I go nuts and get something expensive I might go with a Olympus CX33 $2700 but I don't think I'll bother spending that much. But I have a feeling I'll get something really top tier in the future anyway so why not just get one now...

I am thinking of getting OMAX 40X-2500X Plan Infinity Phase Contrast Trinocular Siedentopf LED Lab Compound Microscope
for $1500
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01BP ... _qh_dp_hza

I'm comparing the omax with the amscope t690 a b and c series. I guess the main difference is the omax has a dark field ability where the amscope does not. But the amscope has Kohler illumination but the omax does not. And I definitely want darkfield but I guess kohler is fairly important?

The t690's all cost $1594. I think the difference is just the eyepieces
https://www.amazon.com/AmScope-T690A-PC ... 110&sr=8-5
https://www.amazon.com/AmScope-T690B-PC ... 110&sr=8-9
https://www.amazon.com/AmScope-T690C-PC ... 110&sr=8-3

Omax:
Brightfield
Darkfield
Phase contrast
Plan Infinity
Does not have Kohler

Amscope:
Brightfield
Does not have Darkfield
Phase contrast
Plan Infinity
Kohler

This one is $2000 and has everything but at that price I might as well get a Olympus CX33 for $2700 I guess
https://www.amazon.com/OMAX-40X-3000X-Q ... 28&sr=8-99

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#8 Post by apochronaut » Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:20 am

Don't believe the specifications attached to internet hawked microscopes. They are derived from a theoretical set of data, not an actual set. One microscope every now and then might meet the specs. but the manufacturing variances and slack q.c. pretty much rule out any consistency. Then there is the outright nonsense that they spin. Absurd horseshit like 2500X. You can have 8 million X if you want , simply be stacking lenses but you wouldn't be able to see anything. At 2500X on one of those microscopes , a paramoecium would look like an omelette. Phase contrast with no Koehler eh? Look it up. Koehler is a required spec. for any decent phase contrast, system....pretty much required like a level floor is necessary to play basketball.

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#9 Post by micro » Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:34 am

Ya I've been reading more on the difference between the chinese knock offs and the good brands and it seems like I should either get the good brand or just stick with my cheap $200 microscope. So I am thinking I will get the olympus CX33 for $2700 but I wonder how good the website selling it is.

https://www.microscopeinternational.com ... icroscope/

It seems legit but I can't really tell. I guess I will email olympus and see if I can buy it directly from them.

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#10 Post by PeteM » Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:45 am

My opinion is that they are legit, but pricey.

For $1000 less you could get a good condition used Olympus BX40 with the same plan infinity achro objectives, a better and wider field trinocular head, and a significantly better design and build quality; Japan for the BX series and (pretty sure) China for the CX series.

https://www.alibaba.com/countrysearch/C ... copes.html

Some on this site have recently bought an older but still modern tech BX40 and can sing its praises. The CX is the lower priced education end of the Olympus line and, while decent, doesn't have the mechanical build quality of the BX and also can't easily upgrade to options like DIC.

Starting with a $1000 budget and willing to stretch to $2700, I'd be inclined to get either the AmScope listed earlier for $1600 if buying new or, better IMO, something like an Olympus BX40 if willing to consider used. AmScope is maybe a decent and affordable Hyundai in automotive terms, the BX more like a high end Lexus just off lease.

I understand the reluctance to consider a used scope, but this (the BX40) is a pretty robust scope. From a reliable seller, looking in good shape, and with some sort of return guarantee, you stand a good chance of getting a better scope for $1000 less.

Here's one esteemed member's experience, that might be a help:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=7756&p=68278&hilit= ... x40#p68278

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#11 Post by micro » Wed Apr 08, 2020 3:13 am

PeteM wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:45 am
Here's one esteemed member's experience, that might be a help:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=7756&p=68278&hilit= ... x40#p68278
hm the specimen pictures in that thread don't seem very good. Probably a camera issue rather than the microscope.


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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#13 Post by 75RR » Wed Apr 08, 2020 6:00 am

If you are in the US you are within a very large used market - simpler and cheaper (shipping charges/customs) to buy local.

So I would skip your first option.

Your second option has Zeiss objectives so I would avoid that seller as well.

Objectives are the heart of a microscope - so you should read up on them. Specifically Olympus ones since that is the brand you are considering.

It should be the first thing you look for in a microscope.
Zeiss Standard WL (somewhat fashion challenged) & Wild M8
Olympus E-P2 (Micro Four Thirds Camera)

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#14 Post by apochronaut » Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:18 am

That's your second mistake. You appear to be focusing on a brand, not a microscope. Wipe all the names out of your head and buy a microscope, not a brand. Choose it by specification and it's capacity to do what you want to do now and in the future , matching that to your budget. The optics on all microscopes built for professional use are very close in performance, when they have been built within the same era. The eras are roughly decades long but more straddle the decades, 1985-1995 for instance. It wouldn't matter whose microscope you would buy from that era for instance, and the optical performance would be within a hair's breadth of any other, with subtle differences rather than dramatic ones. Off brand or amateur microscopes however, use old, poorly copied, or purchased obsolete designs and the differences are more dramatic.

You have been looking at a plan achromat system but for the amount you are planning on spending, it is perfectly within reason for you to be able to find at least some planfluor or planapo objectives in a second hand package.

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Re: Want to buy new compound microscope

#15 Post by 75RR » Thu Apr 09, 2020 7:35 am

.
You are still going to need a name when searching for a microscope, I suspect typing in 'my dream microscope' in Ebay will produce some interesting results ;)

Any of the big four/fiveish are well made and modular (i.e. designed to be upgraded) and you should look at what is available from all of them.

A couple of things to keep in mind.

Ebay and similar sites are not a shop - not in the sense that you can walk in, look over what they have and order.

That can work in a 'shop' that has the same stock all the time but Ebay is constantly in flux and the best option this week may not be so the next.

The best skills when buying there are knowledge, being prepared to ask questions and patience.

You will find when doing your research that the price difference between top of the line finite and infinity objectives is large indeed. Something to think about if you hope to upgrade one day.

The age of a 'named' microscope that has been well cared for is effectively irrelevant. In practice this means that an Olympus BH2 compares very favorably with a BX

Another thing to consider is the support literature. There are excellent repair manuals for the BH2 for example.

Here is a link to a site with very useful info on setting up a camera on a microscope (a must whichever microscope you end up getting), beautiful images and a nicely setup microscope which shall remain nameless.

http://www.krebsmicro.com/
Zeiss Standard WL (somewhat fashion challenged) & Wild M8
Olympus E-P2 (Micro Four Thirds Camera)

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