what about see though spiecemens?

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mrsonchus
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#31 Post by mrsonchus » Tue Jul 12, 2016 2:13 am

carlh6902 wrote:Microinspector, Why not just pound it flat with a big old mallet? Thin it will be. Do you want to examine the structure of your specimens, to "reveal the truth", or do you want to look at smashed bugs? I vote that we are being trolled.

Carl

:lol:
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exmarine
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#32 Post by exmarine » Tue Jul 12, 2016 2:22 am

Hey MicroInspector
What a fascinating idea, I wish I had thought of that. Brilliant!!!!!!
Thank you :shock:
Best regards
exmarine :x

uses Watson 'Service' 1950 compound.
uses Watson Stereo 1960 ish.

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Johann
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Re: idea might work

#33 Post by Johann » Tue Jul 12, 2016 11:11 am

MicroInspector wrote:I have a C clamp in storage
Thinking about using 2 solid bock of wood and some wax paper
Using this to press spiecemens to total flatness
Plants , moss, insects,

Image

:lol: :lol: :lol: MI, you have a good sense of humour :lol:
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MicroInspector
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#34 Post by MicroInspector » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:56 pm

Good lord,
You guys been insisting to make microscope spiecemens
thin as tissue paper.
The microscope reveals the truth of life.
Omax M82EZ microscope

carlh6902
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#35 Post by carlh6902 » Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:18 pm

MicroInspector wrote:Good lord,
You guys been insisting to make microscope spiecemens
thin as tissue paper.
Specimens should indeed be thin. If not, then there is too much "out of focus" stuff in the field of view such that it obscures the detail that would otherwise be present in the focus plane. Also, the resulting light transmission through the specimen will be poor at best. Try to orient specimens on slides such that they lay as flat as possible. Thin sections can be cut to see structure of thicker tissues, etc. Then too, some things are inherently small / flat enough to begin with. But smashing a specimen will only disrupt cells walls and distort the very structures you are wishing to study.

Also, make sure you use proper glass slides and real covers slips. This is critical to achieving the optical performance that your scope is capable of.

Carl
--- If you're in the Kansas City area and you need help with an Olympus BH-2 scope, PM me. I love to work on these things ---

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Dale
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#36 Post by Dale » Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:58 pm

real covers slips......?
Dale
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MicroInspector
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#37 Post by MicroInspector » Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:59 pm

Microbes and water fleas and water micro creatures are very tiny you can't flat them out

P.s I use am scope slides and slip covers
The microscope reveals the truth of life.
Omax M82EZ microscope

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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#38 Post by carlh6902 » Tue Jul 12, 2016 10:56 pm

Dale wrote:real covers slips......?
Dale
You'd be amazed at the number of beginners who complain that they can't see anything through their 40x or 100x objectives. Upon questioning, they are sandwiching the specimen between two slide blanks, and can't get close enough to focus due to the short working distances. Or one guy was using a piece of plastic he cut from something or other. If covers lips of unknown thicknes are used (or omitted when they're needed), aberations can be pretty bad.

Carl
--- If you're in the Kansas City area and you need help with an Olympus BH-2 scope, PM me. I love to work on these things ---

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Dale
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#39 Post by Dale » Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:34 am

Yes, I am truly amazed. I am now treading the murky waters of inverted scopes
and their collared objectives quirks.
Dale
B&L Stereozoom 4. Nikon E600. AO Biostar 1820.

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MicroInspector
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#40 Post by MicroInspector » Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:48 am

But I use am scope slides and slip covers
There is more to see in ponds life is in silt.
You have to go in deeper than the water.
The microscope reveals the truth of life.
Omax M82EZ microscope

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billben74
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#41 Post by billben74 » Thu Jul 14, 2016 6:42 am

If you want to look at whole insect mounts...
Get small ones e.g. fruit flies, kill in 70-80% alcohol.
Wash then in water.
Then clear them by warming at 60 deg C in (vaguely) 1 M NaOH (Sodium Hydroxide) soloution for 2-12 hours.
It varies, they should start to look "glassy".
Wash with water in a small dish ( few times different water).
Now mount with an aqueous mount using a well slide.
The need for a well slide depends on the size of the insect. Better if you can do without, but if its too big you can't.
For a fruit fly its touch and go, I would go for a well slide to begin with,

Now the last bit is fiddly (mount) and in a perfect world you would arrange the insect under a dissecting scope and then mount once ready. And the mounting process leads to bubbles/insect folding all over itself etc at first.

But you do get better with practice. (I'm still not that good at this, done it about 5 times -> maybe at 100 I'll be good)

billbillt
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#42 Post by billbillt » Thu Jul 14, 2016 1:57 pm

I am afraid you kind advice fell on deaf ears..

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MicroInspector
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#43 Post by MicroInspector » Thu Jul 14, 2016 4:52 pm

No it has not....
Ever try to wet mount a knat?
I have caught little spider here.
Interested in seeing details.
It be a jumping spider.
Just wonder if you all like to see it.
The microscope reveals the truth of life.
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Radazz
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Re: what about see though spiecemens?

#44 Post by Radazz » Thu Jul 28, 2016 12:32 pm

Hi, Microinspecter

You can make a permanent slide by starting with a well slide, and making an acetate gasket cut the size of the cover slip with the inside cut out.
stick this down with Canada Balsam or clear nail polish. Then put the specimen in the air space and fill with mounting medium, then seal with a cover slip.
You can also mount them dry with this method. Works pretty good with ants, but spiders and flies tend to spoil over time, unless you prep them.

For temporary slides just for photography, you can build up a dam of petroleum jelly around the edge of the cover slip and put the specimen in the airspace.

Top lighting is essential for photographing and indeed seeing a 3 dimensional specimen. A high intensity desk lamp works good for this.
I have an LED point source attached to a goose neck that I use.

Here is a crab spider dry mounted in this manner. It is still fresh when this shot was taken. This one is in dark field illumination with top lighting.
forum02_edof.jpg
forum02_edof.jpg (248.13 KiB) Viewed 3712 times
Here is another shot of the same mount taken with just top lighting. You can see the deterioration over just a couple of weeks.

forum03.jpg
forum03.jpg (131.37 KiB) Viewed 3712 times
This one is a pavement ant I just sat on a slide without a cover slip and used a blue filter in the condenser tray dimmed down and top lighting for detail.
forum01.jpg
forum01.jpg (221.19 KiB) Viewed 3712 times
So you can indeed use 3 dimensional specimens but the lighting is what will make your images pop.
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