Lymia (français and English)

[Oliver]

Hello "Lymia",

Welcome to the forum!
For observing bacteria you need a microscope with a total magnification of at least about 400x (40x objective and 10x eyepiece). A microscope with a 100x oil immersion objective will give you 1000x maximum magnification. A total magnification of 2000x, as you wrote, is not useful because there is empty magnification (without more image information). This is a physical limit of light and has nothing to do with the quality of the microscope.

Is there a special reason why you want to observe living bacteria? Is this out of pure interest? I am asking, because sometimes people want to observe them in order to diagnose illnesses or to check the quality of the food they eat or water quality. But this is not possible with microscopes, for several reasons. Bacteria are also a bit difficult to observe, because they are small and you need a good microscope preferably phase contrast (expensive). You can see a picture of bacteria on page 20 of the magazine (PDF download):
http://www.microbehunter.com/microbehun ... mber-2014/
These bacteria (dead) were stained black so that they can be seen better even without a phase contrast microscope.

All the best,
Oliver

[75RR]

... I am going to learn all by myself with my microscope... and maybe with the help of people having microscopes on this forum :) .

Hi Lymia,

I am just a beginner, bought my microscope second hand in April this year, but I would suggest, if your budget will allow it, purchasing a Trinocular microscope.
One ocular for the camara and two for you! You will get much more out of your microscope than you will with just a monocular one.
There are some reasonably priced ones in Amazon, and forum members that can recommend one.
Welcome to the fascinating world of microscopy.

[JimT]

Bienvenue. Welcome. Like 75RR I am just a beginner and agree that a trinocular or bibocular microscope is the way to go. I also can recommend Amazon as a good source of quality reasonably priced compound microscopes.

BTW, My wife and I think Quebec is a beautiful city with rich history.

JimT

[gekko]

Hello Lymia,
Welcome to the forum and I hope you'll enjoy your microscope when you get it. If I may, I would like to second what everyone said above. But especially, I would like to emphasize what Oliver said. Diagnosing disease is best left to professionals (I suspect that this is not going to convince you ) Also, if I may, I want to say things that you already know: if you are examining someone else's blood, you must take appropriate protection measures (as I'm sure you know, many nasty pathogens are spread by handling blood unprotected). In terms of examining blood under the microscope, in order that your observations have meaning, I think you must use standard techniques used by lab professionals, including making sure that you use aseptic techniques for the slides, cover glasses, and anything else that the blood comes in contact with, otherwise you cannot tell if what you are looking at came from the blood or was a results of some contamination.

[75RR]

If I may, I will suggest a couple of things.

Firstly, since you are determined to test for Lyme disease and the cautions that both Oliver and gekko mention are very valid, you might consider contacting a Laboratory technician who would be willing, say on a weekend, to either do the tests or train you to be able to do the tests for a fee.

I hope you will be quickly able to ascertain that neither you nor your friends have it.

Secondly, assuming that you might like to expand the use of the microscope beyond that of checking for Lyme disease, I refer to exploring the microscopic world; I would still recommend a Trinocular microscope.
While it is true the a trinocular divides the light 3 ways (I believe the split is 25/25/50), the manufactures of good Trinocular microscopes allow for this in the design and choice of a light source. So you should be ok with one.

[The QCC]

Lymia
You are embarking on a very tricky mission. Testing for Lyme Disease should be done in a full lab.
Before doing your own tests, you should read the following pages
Canadian Lyme Assoc
Ontaroio Ministry of Health
B.C Ministry of Health

You stated a lab tech may not want to help you in your tests, but why not educate yourself at a CEGEP
Dawson College
Heritage College

As you seem determined to proceed, this is my experience with microscopes.
I have three microscopes, one trinocular and two monocular.
By far the brightest is the trinocular with a 100w halogen lamp (Labomed LB-592), next brightest is a Labomed CxL Monocular with a 3watt LED, followed by a AJay Optiks monocular with a 1 watt LED.
The advantage of a trinocular is you do not have to add and remove the camera between slides.
On the trinocular there is no difference in the light intensity between the camera and the eyepieces.

All good microscopes will list the lumen output and colour temperature of the light source.
The 100w halogen is listed at 2000 lumens, 3000°K, the 3w LED is 290 lumens. 7000°K.
If your intent is to dark field microscopy you will need all the light you can get or afford.

Check out these microscopes and prices.
Microscope . com
New York Microscopes

Edit: Added reading material. 8:33PM QCC
Blood microscopy
Darkfield microscopy

[JimT]

One more observation from my own experience. With a monocular scope if you have any floaters in your observing eye they will be very obvious and impact the quality of the image. With two eyepieces the image is much better.

Also Lyme disease needs to be treated early so a lab would be better than a delayed microscope purchase.

Une autre observation de ma propre expérience. Avec un monoculaire portée si vous avez des flotteurs en observant vos yeux ils seront très évident et impact sur la qualité de l'image. Avec deux oculaires l'image est beaucoup mieux.

Aussi maladie de Lyme doit être traitée au plus tôt, pour un laboratoire serait mieux qu'un retard achat microscope

JimT

[75RR]

Hi Lymia,

I am afraid I am going to have to insist on my suggestion that you contact a Laboratory Technician if you are determined to continue with your plan to identify the bacteria that causes Lyme’s disease with a microscope.
At the very least you will require training, training that is neither practical nor realistic to acquire from the “internet”.

There must be many thousands of well-qualified and competent Laboratory Technicians in retirement in Canada. Some of them should be willing to train/advise you.
I suggest you contact one before you purchase a microscope, not only to be able to ascertain that the equipment you get will do what is required but also to get a clearer idea as to the feasibility of your plan.

Having looked at the links you provided and googled "globules rouges spirochètes", I am more convinced than ever that you should contact and talk to an experienced and qualified person before you embark on this project.

[JimT]

Floaters are spots in your vision which are more obvious when looking through a microscope.


Les flotteurs sont les taches de votre vision qui sont plus évidentes lorsqu'on regarde à travers un microscope.

[The QCC]

Lymia:

I can sympathize with you to some extent. My use of a microscope is quite different from most forum members, but I do find some interesting threads to read and photos to appreciate.

Most forum members use their microscopes as a hobby, investigative or curiosity interests.
Diagnosis is a special area that requires professional expertise.

I do hope you will remain as a forum member and post some images of your tests.

P.S.
When you purchase a microscope, get the best you can afford. Buying an inexpensive entry level scope frequently leads to disappointment.
C.

[BingoRingo]

Hello,
I realize now that this forum is not about all kinds of observations with a microscope. The kind of observation that I am mostly interested in is seen as something that should be left only to specialized labs. I did not know this when I subscribed to this forum. So I guess I should not be here on this forum. Thank you for welcoming me and participating with some of my questions. I will continue to read sometimes on this forum as a guest. I am going to unsubscribe soon.

I'm very new here too (Bonjour de l'outaouais!) but I think the purpose of this forum is to discuss pretty much anything related to microscopy. I think the advice is to avoid doing a self diagnostic because it would probably not serve any useful purpose and could potentially have negative consequences depending on what is done after (we do not know your intentions after all).

That being said, soon enough I want to look at my blood under the microscope and if there are nice pictures I'll share them here. I hope you do the same.

Since we're both in Canada, I did a lot of research and found that microscopenet.com had good prices and good quality, you may want to take a look at their website. Shipping is free and they charge you in Canadian currency (as opposed to Amazon.com). When I had a question (see the camera section!) they answered the same day, but I have no idea how they respond to actual service requests.

[Peter]

Hi Lymia,
Please don’t leave the forum, I’m sure we would all be interested in seeing the results of your tests.
The company you wrote to about microscopes has slightly misinformed you, they said of binocular microscopes “they do not require that you close one of your eyes”, I have always understood that you should keep both of your eyes open whilst using a monocular microscope, you will suffer less eyestrain with both eyes open you will, however, need to train your brain to see with each eye independently. Another point is that not all the trinocular microscopes split the light three ways my trinocular head has a sliding prisim which directs the light either to the eyepieces or allows it all to go straight up to the camera.
Good luck in your quest.
Peter.

[gekko]

Hello Lymia, my original concern was that you may be plunging yourself into something that has many attendant risks without being prepared. But from your answers, I now realize that you are aware of the serous risks and potential problems and that you are planning to do this with your eyes fully open. So I say, good luck to you. I would like to join with the other members in hoping that you would not leave this forum .

[BingoRingo]

"But I do not want to make people feel uncomfortable with all the things I might be finding out by myself, out of the official labs. I am not sure I can share on this forum anymore..."

Au contraire!