Hello from North Carolina

What is your microscopy history? What are your interests? What equipment do you use?
Post Reply
Message
Author
Scarodactyl
Posts: 2775
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm

Hello from North Carolina

#1 Post by Scarodactyl » Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:35 pm

Hi everyone. I'm fairly new to microscopy as a hobby--I picked up a gemological microscope for my budding gem lab last year and got the bug. I'd used plenty of petrographic scopes while studying geology, but finally trying a decent stereo scope was a revelation. My main scopes are an SZ7 and an AO580, both on gemolite bases. I'm hoping I might eventually find some help here in adapting a modern camera to the dovetail on the AO580 head, as it seems like it could be challenging.
Here's a picture of my AO580, as well as a couple of pictures shot through my SZ7 (I do have a camera port on it, but am currently just shooting through the eyepiece with my phone and stacking with Helicon).
Image
Image
Olivine crystal in Oregon sunstone surrounded by clouds of copper platelets, FoV 3mm
Image
Crystal plume in agate (probably goethite?), FoV 3mm

einman
Posts: 1508
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#2 Post by einman » Tue Apr 24, 2018 2:17 am

Welcome! Hmm..that adapter looks familiar!

Scarodactyl
Posts: 2775
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#3 Post by Scarodactyl » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:27 am

Yup, as well it should! Thanks again for offering it for sale--it's a pretty remarkable part to find loose, especially at such a great price. The microscope is almost entirely tricked out--I also got a 2x auxiliary for it and did some repairs to the base too. I figure getting a camera adapted is the last thing before it's properly finished.

einman
Posts: 1508
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#4 Post by einman » Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:40 pm

You can purchase an adapter on E-bay ( From RAFCAMERA) however keep in the mind the image projected is significantly larger than what you can see via the eyepieces as this adapter was originally intended to be used with older Polaroid film cameras with significantly larger backs then the sensors in modern DSLR's. However, if you don't mind the magnified image DSLR's will work with the adapter.

PeteM
Posts: 2988
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:22 am
Location: N. California

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#5 Post by PeteM » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:39 pm

The easiest and most compact adaptation might be to a USB or HDMI camera. Since these typically see a smaller part of the image, they might also end up closer to the size seen through the eyepieces. You'd likely want to play around with the distance needed for focus and then either machine or buy an appropriate adapter.

The DSLR offers potentially better images, depending on what you want to pay (e.g. $200 USB camera vs $2000 DSLR?). Could be the USB camera (say 5 megapixel or so) would be good enough.

Scarodactyl
Posts: 2775
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#6 Post by Scarodactyl » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:10 pm

Thanks!
@Einman: I really appreciate the tip, I didn't even think to look for a dovetail adapter. From my measurements it looks like the 580 is about 43mm, so I should probably get this one? https://www.ebay.com/itm/43mm-microscop ... SwfpVZEISh From there I guess I can adapt to most anything?

@Petem: thanks for the advice. I'll have to see what the results are like. It is a stereo scope after all so there are some inherent limitations to the image quality to start with, so I'm not sure to what extent a more powerful camera will be a benefit on it. Still, I am guessing (or at least hoping) it will beat shooting with my phone through the ocular.

Charles
Posts: 1424
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:55 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#7 Post by Charles » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:38 am

Welcome Scarodactyl,

I am just North of you in VA.

The simplest solution is a proper phototube and then either a eyepiece USB camera or eyepiece to camera adapter for your AO 580 and B&L S7.

Here are a couple of photos showing my setup with both the AO 580 and B&L S7.

First the AO 580 with a 34mm phototube and eyepiece to camera adapter for my Canon DSLR.
AO with Camera.jpg
AO with Camera.jpg (118.67 KiB) Viewed 8249 times
Second the B&L S& with a 130mm phototube and the same eyepiece to camera adapter and Canon.
B&L with Camera.jpg
B&L with Camera.jpg (108.77 KiB) Viewed 8249 times
Here is the microscope to Canon camera adapter, I use, on ebay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Microscope-Ada ... SwbWZaWORV

Charles
Posts: 1424
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:55 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#8 Post by Charles » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:58 am

Those are the photo tubes which came with the camera ports. The 34mm tube makes it parfocal on the AO 580 and the 130mm tube parfocal on the B&L. You can also use a USB camera with those tubes. I don't see these phototubes come out on ebay much, so you may need to get some one to turn them on a lathe for you. I can get you exact measurements if you need them to get them made.

Scarodactyl
Posts: 2775
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#9 Post by Scarodactyl » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:02 am

Ooh, thanks for posting that! I like the look of that setup. I do have the original phototube with my SZ7 (one came with the adapter, and I picked up a spare in a parcel of mixed parts on eBay), I just haven't set it up with a camera yet beyond testing it with an eyepiece and my phone. The one challenge there is that the gemolite is a tiltable base and I'm not sure whether the adapter will hold up to the weight of a larger camera if things aren't fully horizontal. I do have one of the other style SZ7 adapters as well which doesn't have threads, and I imagine that paired with a tougher tube might be more robust.
The one for the 580 looks really interesting. It doesn't look like anything I've seen in the AO/Reichert catalogs, though admittedly I haven't spent a lot of time looking through them. I wonder if I could attach a tube of appropriate length to the eBay dovetail adapter I linked above or whether I'd need to have something custom made.

Charles
Posts: 1424
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:55 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#10 Post by Charles » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:09 am

The adapter slides into the phototube the same distance as an eyepiece and it is quite secure. Modern DSLRs without lens are pretty light and I could probably tilt my scopes with camera connected over 45 degrees. But, you can also use those eyepice USB cameras as well.

Looking and comparing your camera port to mine, yours looks like it has a larger diameter than mine.

User avatar
zzffnn
Posts: 3200
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2015 3:57 am
Location: Houston, Texas, USA
Contact:

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#11 Post by zzffnn » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:33 am

Welcome to the forum!

If you want very high quality stacked images, you should use compound scopes or compound objectives connected with camera (lens). Most stereo scopes, including SZ7 and AO580, do not do image stacking well, due to their optical design and distortion (even though they used to be research grade stereo scopes and they excel at direct observation and helping with subject manipulation).

This guy uses compound objectives connected to camera
http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/v ... &start=165

Scarodactyl
Posts: 2775
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:09 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#12 Post by Scarodactyl » Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:06 am

I've been considering that option--hooking a camera up to a gemological microscope is less with the intention of making high-powered print grade photos as it is of being able to document what you're seeing clearly without having to move the sample back and forth to a dedicated photo setup. But I would love to be able to take high-powered print grade photos. What kind of depth of field do you get on this sort of camera-objective setup? Because a lot of features of gemological interest are inside stones it's important to be able to focus a ways beyond the end of the objective. I remember being very frustrated at trying to use the petrographic compound scopes in our geology department to look at gem inclusions because I couldn't focus deep enough into the stones (also the lighting, of course, though that's a different matter). One way or another, though, a nice dedicated photo setup is definitely on my list of future projects.

User avatar
zzffnn
Posts: 3200
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2015 3:57 am
Location: Houston, Texas, USA
Contact:

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#13 Post by zzffnn » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:31 am

High resolution compound objective always means shallow depth of field and inability of looking into mineral inclusions. There is likely no way around it.

Moisturizing minerals with light oil may help a little bit with inclusions.

billbillt
Posts: 2895
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:01 pm

Re: Hello from North Carolina

#14 Post by billbillt » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:32 pm

zzffnn wrote:Welcome to the forum!

If you want very high quality stacked images, you should use compound scopes or compound objectives connected with camera (lens). Most stereo scopes, including SZ7 and AO580, do not do image stacking well, due to their optical design and distortion (even though they used to be research grade stereo scopes and they excel at direct observation and helping with subject manipulation).

This guy uses compound objectives connected to camera
http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/v ... &start=165
Fan,
Thanks for the link... The photos were exquisite..

BillT

Post Reply