Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

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BoiseDave
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:09 pm

Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#1 Post by BoiseDave » Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:25 pm

Hi,
I realize this forum is mainly about compound microscopy, but on the off chance that anyone here uses a dissecting scope much, I wonder if they could offer a comparison between the Meiji EM-20 series and Swift's SM101C/SM102C series, especially in terms of quality of optics.
Thanks much,
Dave in Boise

einman
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Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#2 Post by einman » Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:50 pm

I use a lot of stereoscopes although mostly the higher end research scopes from the 80's and 90's. I have used both the swift and Meiji and find the Meiji tends to have better optics however that primarily applies to their higher end models. The lower end models like the 20 series tend to be comparable across all brands in terms of performance as they tend to be cookie cutter Chinese models. Meiji was once only manufactured in Japan. Although I believe that is only true for their higher end models now. Swift is a Chinese manufactured scope for sure. When talking low end stereoscopes I find them to be very similar in performance across brands.

einman
Posts: 1508
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#3 Post by einman » Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:07 pm

Depending on your budget I would recommend looking at an AO 580 or a B&L SZ7. The AO 580 goes to 60X and the SZ7 to 70x. The optics are beautiful assuming you obtain a good example. To purchase a Chinese stereoscope that goes to 60X without the use of higher mag eyepieces or objectives will cost you significantly more.

In terms of resolution both the 580 and the SZ7 have a resolution of about 300 lpm comparable to superior to some of the higher end Chinese scopes. While teh SZ7 can be fitted with a DSLR rather easily, if purchased with the trinocular attachment, the 580 requires a little more effort.

The Nikon SMZ-2T is also a very nice scope, goes to 63X as delivered with a 1x objective and 10x eyepieces and sells on E-bay for about $500-$600 or so. It is a beautiful scope and will perform better than either of the models you have mentioned.

einman
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Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#4 Post by einman » Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:32 pm

Here are some used scopes I would highly recommend:

AO 580
B&L SZ7
Nikon SMZ-2T
Nikon SMZ-U
Olympus SZH
Olympus SZH10
Zeiss Stemi SR
Zeiss Stemi SV8


I own or have owned all of these scopes. The Zeiss SR is a beast. Very large and very heavy. The optics are extremely good. If interested PM me and I can tell you where you can get one for far less than you are prepared to pay for significantly inferior models. I do not own this particular example, although I do own an SR, but am familiar with it.

BoiseDave
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:09 pm

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#5 Post by BoiseDave » Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:46 pm

Einman,

Thanks much for the list of scopes (I can't private message you yet--seems I need to be here longer before I can do that).

I would love your thoughts on where I could get one of those models at an affordable price!

Thanks much,
Dave in Boise

apochronaut
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Joined: Fri May 15, 2015 12:15 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#6 Post by apochronaut » Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:55 pm

For someone on a budget, who is aiming for image quality as their primary goal, I would also recommend the AO Cycloptic. There were zillions of Cycloptics sold, since the early 60's and many of the ones around have seen better days but there are still good ones out there. The Cycloptic is not zoom but has a rotary drum objective changer, which normally offers between 7 and 80X magnification with added 15X eyepieces and a 2X auxiliary objective.
However, for routine use in the 1.4X-25X range in 25 possible increments of magnification, it can use one it's 5 different apochromatic primary objectives , so the resolution and colour correction of the image is extremely fine, lacking the colouration found in the specular highlights with achromatic systems. With the two low power primary objectives, it has a more than 12 cm. working distance. The Cycloptic does not provide the convenience of zoom but it does provide better imaging at magnifications, certainly up to 25X and probably above that too, for the convenience of zoom forces optical compromises on the designer, that can only be dealt with at ridiculously high prices.

AO used a single roof prism on each side of the cycloptic head and the prisms were permanently cemented into place. Quite a few have received enough of a shock at some point that one or both of the prisms have become loose, so they have received a bit of a bad rap as being fragile. However, with the sheer numbers of them out there and their years of use in industrial applications, there are bound to be lots of surplus junkers around.There are still lots of good ones out there too, so one need check to be certain that the instrument offered is good. Fixing the prisms is possible though, with a simple workaround.

One extra bonus with those three American made stereo microscopes is that they take the U.W.F. 5 element Bausch & Lomb 15X eyepieces admirably , providing around a 25mm F.N. with stupendous sharpness and field flatness for 15X eyepieces. They are enormous though, with a pair weighing 1 1/4 lbs. but everything is nicely tucked into a 23mm standard tube. I do not know how they would work on scopes of other manufacture but using a Cycloptic with a pair of those, is a whole other experience, than one gets with most stereo microscopes under 1000.00. The only equivalent might be the Wild apos and then you are into some pretty hefty $.

BoiseDave
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Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#7 Post by BoiseDave » Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:16 pm

Apochronaut,

Thanks much for your recommendations. (I'm not able to private message yet).

Any suggestions as to where I might begin to hunt for an AO Cycloptic (or any other of these used scopes, for that matter)?

Dave in Boise

apochronaut
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Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#8 Post by apochronaut » Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:31 pm

Heres, one listed as refurbished on ebay. Has the lamp too.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/AO-Spencer-Ste ... Sw7yZalsyu


You can make up an attachment to the eyepiece for doing photomicrography , or they did have a trinocular photo tube cat.# 638

There was an additional substage, that AO called a transillumination base; cat.# 58S. With that accessory, the microscope was attached on top of it, lifting it about 3". There is an adjustable mirror in the base and by installing the nose of the lamp into the port in the back, you could illuminate with transmitted light, in the same way as a conventional biological microscope does. There was also a double power transformer for the illuminator, which allowed for any arrangement of two lights: symmetrical incident, asymmetrical incident, incident and transmitted , incident oblique and transmitted, etc. Another useful accessory is the mechanical stage. cat.#1556.

einman
Posts: 1508
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:03 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#9 Post by einman » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:13 pm

I agree with Apo. I enjoy the Cycloptic as well. Magnification is more limited but the optics are quite nice if not quite as sharp. The image is generally brighter than the AO 580 though. In regards to the B&L WF 15X eyepieces Apo is correct as well. I have used them for my Balplan, SZ7 and others. They are quite impressive, approaching the imagery obtained when using using the 30 mm widefield eyepieces from Nikon, Leitz, Olympus and Zeiss. What is impressive is they offer a 20mm FOV which is the same as their 10x eyepieces! I do not believe another manufacturer offers equivalent FOV to the 10x when jumping to 15X eyepieces.
Last edited by einman on Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:22 pm, edited 3 times in total.

apochronaut
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Joined: Fri May 15, 2015 12:15 am

Re: Meiji versus Swift dissecting microscope?

#10 Post by apochronaut » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:47 pm

Here is the only current listing of those U.W.F. 15X eyepieces. These people want quite a bit for them but then they say they are new. At one time, when they first were made for the military reconnaisance microscopes, they were around 2000.00/pr. The eyepieces were made by Bausch & Lomb but also sported the name FJW Industries, Reichert and I think Leica too. B & L branded some for FJW, then when Cambridge took on B & L, they rearranged a certain amount of the conglomerate of production to carry the Reichert name and it morphed into Leica.

The field with these is really broad so some objectives may not have a large enough image circle, and vignette a little. I presume they would be o.k. with any scope that does not require corrective eyepieces but the only ones I have used them in are the AO diascopic scopes from series 4 forward, the AO stereo scopes from the Cycloptic forward and the B & L stereozooms.

The Cycloptic image circle is just a hair's small for these and the field flatness varies somewhat between objectives . Magnifications available on the changer are 10x,15X,20X,30X and 40X with 15X eyepieces and the field coverage is about 7 1/4mm. at 40X. 10 and 15X are quite flat, 20X displays some curvature and lack of planarity, and 30x, very slight curvature and 40X flat.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Reichert-15x-U ... SwHnFV10ed

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