Considering an inverted

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mintakax
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Considering an inverted

#1 Post by mintakax » Fri Sep 27, 2019 5:34 pm

I've been considering purchasing an inverted scope to compliment my BHS/BH2. I'm still somewhat a beginner and I've never used one before so I'm not sure what to expect. I am hoping that I will be able to view/video organisms without mounting them on a slide and perhaps to isolate a few for slide mounting and further inspecting on the other scope. I definitely want to buy used, but want an instrument thats ready to go. I have been extremely pleased with DIC on my BHS/Bh2, and would prefer this on any future scopes if possible, but don't want fluorescence . I have been looking at this one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-Diaphot- ... Swy5ZXCqal,

but wondering if it isn't overpriced by a ways. I've seen other offerings by this dealer that are clearly way over priced (compared to what I've seen recently). I suppose I would need to add a 20x non-phase objective for 20x DIC ?

Any suggestions on this or any other inverted scopes ?

Thanks,
Dan

MicroBob
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Re: Considering an inverted

#2 Post by MicroBob » Fri Sep 27, 2019 6:08 pm

Hi Dan,
DIC components are fairly expensive so you might consider an inverted microscope that can take your existing Olympus set - if this is possible.
There are petri dished made from glass but there are also culture bottles made from plastics where the DIC polarizer would lead to irritating colour effects due to the birefringent plastic material. This was the reason for systems like Zeiss PlasDIC.
A very simple and cheap Olympus CK would be good enough for picking out organisms and see if you really like to do this and enjoy it.

Bob

mintakax
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Re: Considering an inverted

#3 Post by mintakax » Fri Sep 27, 2019 7:09 pm

MicroBob wrote:
Fri Sep 27, 2019 6:08 pm
Hi Dan,
DIC components are fairly expensive so you might consider an inverted microscope that can take your existing Olympus set - if this is possible.
There are petri dished made from glass but there are also culture bottles made from plastics where the DIC polarizer would lead to irritating colour effects due to the birefringent plastic material. This was the reason for systems like Zeiss PlasDIC.
A very simple and cheap Olympus CK would be good enough for picking out organisms and see if you really like to do this and enjoy it.

Bob
Thanks Bob--

I was wondering if maybe DIC wouldn't be the best route for an inverted. Not requiring it opens up the field a lot. I like your suggestion of a cheap scope to start, but I should at least have phase, no ?

Dan

Hobbyst46
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Re: Considering an inverted

#4 Post by Hobbyst46 » Fri Sep 27, 2019 7:20 pm

mintakax wrote:I was wondering if maybe DIC wouldn't be the best route for an inverted. Not requiring it opens up the field a lot. I like your suggestion of a cheap scope to start, but I should at least have phase, no ?
The Olympus CK as well as other low price inverted scopes are routinely used for tissue culture and live cell prapagation experiments.
As such, they are usually equipped with phase contrast. Because animal cells are fairly transparent and phase contrast is necessary. DIC is installed in costly research "system" microscopes. Many modern 35mm petri dishes and multiwell dishes have a glass coverslip bottom that enables DIC, and are expensive. They are meant to be dispensable, but can be recycled many times. So they are practical for hobby use as well.
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MicroBob
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Re: Considering an inverted

#5 Post by MicroBob » Fri Sep 27, 2019 7:58 pm

The CK, old-timer from 1960s on, was usually sold with bright field but there was a phase contrast kit for it. The illumination is barely acceptable for the 20:1 objective in bright field so for the 20:1 phase contrast this will have been a problem. An LED upgrade wouldn't be difficult to make though. Maybe the phase condenser made better use of the bulb's output?
Here is a link to the CK brochure: http://www.alanwood.net/downloads/olymp ... ochure.pdf

My impression is that newer, but not research grade inverteds can be bought for comparativly little money too. The CK is very basic with just coarse adjustment.

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ImperatorRex
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Re: Considering an inverted

#6 Post by ImperatorRex » Fri Sep 27, 2019 8:42 pm

Here is a really cheap offer:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carl-Zeiss-IM- ... SwE21dYKWW
On such old Zeiss IM35 I often found that nosepiece and stage table / speciment carrier needed some re-greasing. Other than that components are very well available on ebay (obejctives..)

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Re: Considering an inverted

#7 Post by wstenberg » Fri Sep 27, 2019 10:50 pm

I have this one. Currently for sale on Ebay.
It needs a binocular and light, both easily available.
I was using until recently; I'm trying to make some room on the bench.
It's very heavy, but that make it very stable. Nice big stage. It has a camera port on the front, and another on the side.
Please contact me if interested.
Thanks!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Zeiss-Microsco ... SwSn1dh8Ji
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mintakax
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Re: Considering an inverted

#8 Post by mintakax » Sat Sep 28, 2019 12:46 am

Thanks all ! I am grateful for your responses and advice. No matter if an inverted works for me or not, I do want a research grade instrument. I am a snob when it comes to optical equipment having been involved in photography, underwater videography and astro photography for years. I have a pretty decent budget and would pay extra for a complete, clean unit with all parts compatible. That said, I am really a bit horrified at the Ebay offerings and descriptions. Misspellings of key terms ( "phase constrast codenser & phase constract objetives' ) , no real descriptions, adds that say "see pictures for description". Not to mention the vast variation in price that doesn't really seem to correlate with the quality of components. I realize that I was very fortunate with my BHS/BH2 purchase. The price was good and I couldn't be happier with it.
If nothing shows up in a few weeks I guess I'll go down the road of buying something inexpensive and building it up to what I want, but I'd rather spend the time observing and recording :) . I'm keeping my eye on Olympus IMT-2 instruments.

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ImperatorRex
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Re: Considering an inverted

#9 Post by ImperatorRex » Sat Sep 28, 2019 7:59 am

Hi mintakax,
probabely difficult to find a "real" complete set thats completely ready and available for use (at least on ebay). For me it is not an issue since I like to grap for parts and pieces, maybe I like this even more than observing pond samples itself :-)

I like the article from Steve Beats very much, I can see much coincidence here:

http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/ind ... zeiss.html

Maybe below is also an interesting offer:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/OLYMPUS-IX70-I ... Sw99Jdfv1G

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Re: Considering an inverted

#10 Post by Hobbyst46 » Sat Sep 28, 2019 9:12 am

ImperatorRex wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 7:59 am
Maybe below is also an interesting offer:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/OLYMPUS-IX70-I ... Sw99Jdfv1G
Very impressive infinity corrected phase contrast optics. A fantastic system instument, but if the price goes up in the bid, I would verify that the mechanics are all in working order, otherwise repairs might be costly.

The article by Steve Beats is a pleasure to read; it can aid a microscopist conclude if he/she is a more a collector than user, or vice versa... both directions are rewarding.
Zeiss Standard GFL+Canon EOS-M10, Olympus VMZ stereo

mintakax
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Re: Considering an inverted

#11 Post by mintakax » Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:49 pm

Hobbyst46 wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 9:12 am
ImperatorRex wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 7:59 am
Maybe below is also an interesting offer:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/OLYMPUS-IX70-I ... Sw99Jdfv1G
Very impressive infinity corrected phase contrast optics. A fantastic system instument, but if the price goes up in the bid, I would verify that the mechanics are all in working order, otherwise repairs might be costly.

The article by Steve Beats is a pleasure to read; it can aid a microscopist conclude if he/she is a more a collector than user, or vice versa... both directions are rewarding.
Thanks Jochen and Hobbyst46-- That looks like an impressive instrument. Is it missing the x-y stage ? The objectives look perfect. Anything else that looks like it needs ? Given its coming from (and going back to if problem) Singapore I don't think its the instrument for me. I'm hesitant to buy used from overseas.

Cool article , thanks!

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Re: Considering an inverted

#12 Post by KurtM » Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:36 am

For whatever it's worth, I obtained a Nikon Diaphot TMD equipped with phase and with DIC from the guy in the eBay ad in the original post, very similar to the one linked to above, and have been past delighted with it. I had tried a couple other inverted scopes but could never quite get comfortable with them; but the Nikon fits me so well it quickly became my go-to scope and still is a year later. The seller may ask big prices, but he's committed to providing working systems, not turning over worn out, partially complete, badly neglected surplus stuff covered in warehouse rash. I too am horrified by what I see on eBay, and buying from this guy is how I avoided those pitfalls. I give him and his wares a thumbs-up.
Cheers,
Kurt Maurer
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