Taking it to the next level

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btschumy
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Taking it to the next level

#1 Post by btschumy » Sun Jan 08, 2017 3:35 am

I'm still fairly new to microphotography. Only been at it a couple of weeks. However, now I'm wondering what I need to do to take my imaging to the next level. I've seen many jaw dropping shots from you guys and wonder what I need to do to get there. Things I've considered.

1. Read more and practice (Duh).
2. Get some better objectives. I have achromatic objectives and wonder if FL or App would make a noticeable difference. In some of the images below I do see some CA.
3. Learn how to focus stack to increase depth of field.
4. Get a better camera. I am using an 9 year old Canon 450 (XSi).
5. Get my microscope serviced. It is not in bad shape but there does seem to be a slight haze when looking down the trinocular tube without an eyepiece.
6. Work on my post-processing techniques.

Below are some of my better shots so you can see what level I'm at now. How do I get better?
Attachments
Closterium & Diatom.jpg
Closterium & Diatom.jpg (15.12 KiB) Viewed 5543 times
Peritrich.jpg
Peritrich.jpg (38.01 KiB) Viewed 5543 times
Unknown Ciliate.jpg
Unknown Ciliate.jpg (32.52 KiB) Viewed 5543 times
Spirogyra.jpg
Spirogyra.jpg (45.7 KiB) Viewed 5543 times
Algae.jpg
Algae.jpg (60.93 KiB) Viewed 5543 times
Bill Tschumy
Leitz SM-D LUX
AO Spencer "Cycloptic" Stereo Microscope (Series 56C)

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Pat Thielen
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#2 Post by Pat Thielen » Sun Jan 08, 2017 4:33 am

Hi there!

I am definitely on the learning curve still myself but I just wanted to chime in real quick. I think one of the best things you can do is exactly what you're doing -- Ask what you can do better. That's something I'm doing myself. Personally, I think you have taken some great images -- The vorticella one is especially good and I'm sure was a very tricky subject to photograph. Your first image of the diatoms would be even better with a good focus stack. I've been working on that technique myself and I have a fair amount of work ahead of me, but it is well worth learning. I've also found that learning about my equipment is really quite essential, and people on this board are very happy to help out. I was having trouble understanding how my condenser worked as I've never had a microscope with one until very recently. So, never be afraid to ask the "dumb question," I've found no-one here considers such questions dumb (and I've asked a few myself).

Personally, I think you're off to a grand start and I really look forward to seeing more of your work as you progress. It is very satisfying seeing new work compared to old and noticing just how much progress you've made without perhaps even realizing it. Sorry I can't give too many direct answers -- I know there are others who will stop in and give their opinions and advice as well. And there's this: Practice! At least with digital you can't waste film!

:)
Pat Thielen
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zzffnn
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#3 Post by zzffnn » Sun Jan 08, 2017 4:51 am

Bill,

Your photos look very nice to me. I am not sensitive to CA, but yes, getting apo objectives will definitely improve your imaging.

Have you tried oblique illumination? It will increase focus depth for fast moving (no stackable) critters. It.looks like you used flash and standard brightfield in the above images.

Have you tried to blow air onto that "haze"? It may not affect brightfield images that much.

Imaging issues may manifest more at higher magnification and NA (at your current magnification, they won't be that obvious). For example, at NA 1.25, oil immersion on Abbé condenser will help with imaging. Better still, use an achromatic aplanatic condenser.

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billben74
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#4 Post by billben74 » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:01 am

All of your suggestions are good ones.
I would go for the ones that focus on you gaining more skill, rather buying more expensive equipment.
I've had my microscope (and canon 1200D) for just over a year and most of my improvements have come from.
1) learning how to better prepare a specimen for imaging. (not obvious but I leanrt a lot from miscape below).
2) learning how to stack
3) how to clean up background (digitally)
4) learning to get the colour balance (in canon EOS software this means using little dropper on what you think is white)
5) learning how to use the levels tool after image is taken -> black/white point/dark red etc.
6) learing the other light/colour tools (hue/saturation etc.)
7) Using the sharp tool.
8) learning to stitch.
I have also developed a reflected light set up as I enjoy relflected light work as much as transmitted.

I am not an expert at any of these! But I am a lot better than when I started.

After a year I have just bought my first fluor x4 objective for $60 (although it cost me 110 after tax/post etc).
It is better than my previous one although I will need to investigate further to see how much better -> it has a downside more na means less depth of focus so for some subjects it might be worse.

Also remember that some subjects are lot easier than others.
Moving things are (obviously) hard. Do you know about methyl cellulose to slow critters down? see http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/ind ... otech.html
Flat, thin, things are easier, especially for transmitted light, otherwise sharp focus might not be possible (or at least less possible)

For reflected the surface has to be "hard" e.g. if reflection occurs at multiple surfaces or if, say, covered in a fine dust of chalk (a shell I was working on) light scatters and sharp focus might simply not be possible.

Do you know about http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/ ? Not a forum but a treasure trove of microscope/photomicrography information. You do have to dig a bit though.
or "the other place" http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/ -> more technical and focused on photography

But, remember its a lot of fun trying.

Your images are very nice right now.

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75RR
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#5 Post by 75RR » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:37 am

I would go for the ones that focus on you gaining more skill, rather buying more expensive equipment.
Agree with billben74, improving skills (one never stops) is the both the cheapest and the best way to go.
Those amazing images one sees in the photomacrography forum are in my view about 90% Skill/technique.
That is not to take away the importance of good equipment, just that it takes a lot of skill to get the most out of it.

Having said that, an increase in an objective's NA goes a long way.
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einman
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#6 Post by einman » Sun Jan 08, 2017 4:09 pm

They look quite nice actually. The advice being given is appropriate although it looks like you already have the basics firm in hand.

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btschumy
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#7 Post by btschumy » Sun Jan 08, 2017 4:52 pm

Thanks for the replies.

Sounds like I should definitely investigate focus stacking. Does anyone have any good tutorials online? I use a Mac so are there any recommendations for stacking software that is cross-platform or runs on a Mac?

With regards to billben's other suggestions:
4) learning to get the colour balance (in canon EOS software this means using little dropper on what you think is white)
I know about this and have been using it recently.
5) learning how to use the levels tool after image is taken -> black/white point/dark red etc.
As I said, I use a Mac and do much of my post processing in their "Photos" application. It doesn't have histogram level tools like Photoshop but works at a higher level (pun intended) as you can see in the attached image. I think it does the same thing ultimately. I do play with these quite a bit, trying to get the most pleasing image. I'm somewhat haphazard in my approach, but I've figured out what subset of the controls seem work best for me. I'm sure I'll refine this as I learn more.
6) learing the other light/colour tools (hue/saturation etc.)
I definitely make adjustments using these.
7) Using the sharp tool.
There is a "Definition" tool in Photos. I generally give a small bump on all my images.
8) learning to stitch.
This I don't know how to do. Right now I don't feel limited in what I can capture in a single image. I can see if I'm at > 40x it might be useful to stick together several images to make a mosaic.

What I'm hearing is that people don't think my equipment is the limiting factor (too bad as I like buying new equipment :D ). I should just work on my technique. I might get a single 25 or 40x Apo objective just to see what the difference would be. If I do notice a large change I can start scouring eBay to complete the set.
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Bill Tschumy
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AO Spencer "Cycloptic" Stereo Microscope (Series 56C)

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zzffnn
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#8 Post by zzffnn » Sun Jan 08, 2017 4:56 pm

Some forum members use Microsoft Image Composite Editor (ICE) for stitching.

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hkv
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#9 Post by hkv » Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:18 pm

btschumy wrote:Thanks for the replies.

Sounds like I should definitely investigate focus stacking. Does anyone have any good tutorials online? I use a Mac so are there any recommendations for stacking software that is cross-platform or runs on a Mac?

I run MAC as well and use Zerene for stacking. I did a survey a couple of years ago and concluded that this was the best software if I run a MAC. Works very well and is easy to use. They also have pretty good manuals online.
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#10 Post by Peter » Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:57 pm

Hi Btschumy,
A good DIC microscope would catapult your photos to near the top of the heap.
Peter.

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btschumy
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Re: Taking it to the next level

#11 Post by btschumy » Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:46 am

hkv,

Thanks for the pointer to Zerene. I've read the tutorials and everything seems understandable. Changing focus using the focus knob seems like a relatively easy situation for Zerene to handle. No change in perspective or frame. I will download the trial and give it a try in a day or two.

It does seem like all the moving critters in the background could cause a problem even if trying to capture something stationary like algae. I guess you just "repair" those glitches out of existence in the final stack?
Bill Tschumy
Leitz SM-D LUX
AO Spencer "Cycloptic" Stereo Microscope (Series 56C)

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