‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

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MichaelG.
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‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#1 Post by MichaelG. » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:08 pm

Does anyone happen to know the details of the various ‘species’ of this useful genus ?

I bought one on Saturday, but it is the ‘less convenient’ version … similar to the one shown at right in Fig.2 of Peter Evennett’s seminal paper: “The new photomicrography” https://www.mccrone.com/wp-content/uplo ... camera.pdf … although mine is only marked 10x and does not indicate the field size.

A copy of the ‘Family Tree’ would be useful.

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Alexander
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#2 Post by Alexander » Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:12 am

Leitz changed from 170 mm tube length to 160 mm end of the seventies. Eye pieces without the field value are generally made for 170 mm tube length while those with it are for 160 mm.

A "Periplan GF 10x" is for 170 mm.
A "Periplan GF 10x18" is for 160 mm.

You can use 170 mm eye pieces on a 160 mm stand with spacers but not the other way around.

MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#3 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:05 am

Alexander wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:12 am
Eye pieces without the field value are generally made for 170 mm tube length while those with it are for 160 mm.
That’s interesting, thanks Alexander
… although I find ‘generally’ an unfortunate term in this situation

My new-to-me ‘10x goggles’ eyepiece looks just like the ‘10x/18 goggles’ in Peter’s paper, except for the printing … and neither of them carries a part number.

Hence my desire for an identification guide

MichaelG.
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Dubious
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#4 Post by Dubious » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:14 am

A list of the Periplan family would be useful, but I haven't seen one, just partial lists, such as the one on page 17 here, showing the Periplan eyepieces available for the Dialux circa 1972:

http://earth2geologists.net/Microscopes ... g_1972.pdf

MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#5 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:38 am

Table copied here, for convenient reference:
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Thanks
MichaelG.

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Edit: I note 519 135 listed
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Alexander
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#6 Post by Alexander » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:49 am

This list is all 170 mm.

MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#7 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:25 am

Alexander wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:49 am
This list is all 170 mm.
Yes, I do realise that

The famous 160mm Memorandum is dated 9/30/76

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MicroBob
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#8 Post by MicroBob » Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:38 am

Hi together,
here two threads from the german forum:
At the end of the page you can find a mix and match - table!
https://www.mikroskopie-forum.de/index. ... 1#msg87701

https://www.mikroskopie-forum.de/index. ... ic=28201.0

Generally it is important to know the differences as there are as well good and bad combinations.

Bob

MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#9 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:13 pm

Many thanks for those links, Bob

I will have a good look at them this evening.

[ currently tinkering with an early model Olympus CK inverted, and don’t want to ‘lose my place’ ]

MichaelG.
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MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#10 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 6:19 pm

Post #6 in Bob’s first link is important … and confirms Alexander’s assertion.

It also explains why my ‘new’ eyepiece works nicely on my 170mm ‘scope.

MichaelG.
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MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#11 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:59 pm

This … translated from Post #19 in Bob’s second link, is a useful summary of the compatibility issue:
The last point in the Leitz letter quoted by Wolfgang gives the answer: 160mm eyepieces cannot be used on 170mm tripods.

Why is that?

The optics of 160mm and 170mm eyepieces simply cannot be identical: Because the 170mm eyepieces are calculated for an object distance of 18mm, the 160s for one of 10mm. The compensation effects, however, are the same for both - as is clear from the guiding letter - so that the image error correction of the intermediate image results in the same image quality with correct optical application in each case. Based on these considerations, 170 eyepieces can be used on 160 tripods with the appropriate extension (this can be done with extension rings on the eyepiece or on the objective of 8mm), but not 160 eyepieces on 170 tripods; one would then have to shorten the tube by 8mm so that the intermediate image would be where it is expected from a 160 eyepiece.


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Dubious
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#12 Post by Dubious » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:38 pm

But you would be able to use either a 160 or 170 Periplan as a photo relay lens, assuming the port/tube allowed adjustment of placement? I've tried several different Periplans as a photo eyepiece in my (160) Laborlux 12. Currently, I'm using a (160) 10x18 Periplan, which I believe gives better contrast than the (170--I think) 8x Periplan it replaced.

dtsh
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#13 Post by dtsh » Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:18 am

Dubious wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:38 pm
But you would be able to use either a 160 or 170 Periplan as a photo relay lens, assuming the port/tube allowed adjustment of placement? I've tried several different Periplans as a photo eyepiece in my (160) Laborlux 12. Currently, I'm using a (160) 10x18 Periplan, which I believe gives better contrast than the (170--I think) 8x Periplan it replaced.
I bought an AO 10 setup for imaging some time back and it came with a Leitz Periplan GF 10x in the photo tube. It appears to my eye to produce a decent image, but considering my lack of skill with imaging that might not mean much.
If anyone is interested, I could attempt imaging with it.

MicroBob
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#14 Post by MicroBob » Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:15 am

Have a look here for Leitz camera adaptation with hybrid eyepieces:
[urlhttps://microscopyofnature.com/microphotography-hybrid-eyepiecesurl]

@Michael: In case you would like to use the Olympus CK with 45mm objectives you would have to raise the table. Otherwise the mirror will cut of part of the image. Good quality and strange looking microscope.

Dubious
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#15 Post by Dubious » Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:20 am

I did try something very similar to that a few iterations ago--in my case Periplan 8x glass on a 6x barrel. It worked, but not as well as the Periplan 10x18 I am using now. Lot's of possible combinations and I may try a few more :D

MichaelG.
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Re: ‘High Eyepoint’ Leitz Periplans

#16 Post by MichaelG. » Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:09 am

MicroBob wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:15 am
@Michael: In case you would like to use the Olympus CK with 45mm objectives you would have to raise the table. Otherwise the mirror will cut of part of the image. Good quality and strange looking microscope.
Thanks for the advisory note, Bob
I haven’t yet decided what objectives to use
… it came with an Olympus 4x and two generic Chinese [10x and 40x]

I bought it on Saturday, at a modest price, knowing that it needed some work
So far, I have freed-up and re-lubricated the eyepiece dioptric adjuster, and the focus mechanism in the condenser.
… biggest problem was that one of the table extensions was seized in place
… removing this required more brute force than I like to use, but we got there in the end.

Incidentally … it’s the very early model, with the straight ‘observation tube’

MichaelG.

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