Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

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scubacanz
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Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#1 Post by scubacanz » Tue Nov 30, 2021 8:54 pm

Hi all, I'm looking to upgrade my microscope from my Swift 380T to something that offers better lighting, more options (phase contrast, etc), and better optics. Right now the quote I have for the baseline Motic Panthera C2 is $2k (ish). I would have loved to see pictures/videos taken with this microscope, and get feedback from others on what it's like but it seems to be so new I've not been able to find anything on it.

Based on my research thus far I have the impression Motic microscopes are the only affordable microscopes (purchased new) for hobbyists/photomicrographers. I may be wrong though.

My primary goal is good photomicrography and videography for educational/science communication purposes.

Could anyone comment on the Panthera C2, or other affordable (and preferably better options)?

Thanks so much!

Scarodactyl
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#2 Post by Scarodactyl » Tue Nov 30, 2021 9:25 pm

If you want affordable and high performance the used market is where it's at, though it's a lot harder if you're in Europe. Motic makes solid products, but for 2k you can usually get a lot more with some patience.

Dubious
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#3 Post by Dubious » Tue Nov 30, 2021 9:27 pm

There was a discussion about the Panthera, that mentioned some photos on a German site:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11656&p=95974&hilit=panthera#p95974

For new microscopes, Amscope is probably the most affordable. I see it has infinity systems with phase contrast turret and objectives as low as $1,600, and finite systems even lower.

https://amscope.com/collections/compoun ... e-contrast

PeteM
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#4 Post by PeteM » Wed Dec 01, 2021 12:08 am

Where are you located? If in the US, there are many options for higher quality used microscopes.

If your main objective is to produce top quality photos and videos for educational purposes, it might make sense to think through things from the camera end, then the photo relay optics and microscope that will be compatible. We have many users here who have bought a new $1K microscope and then struggled to get good images from say, an import USB camera costing up to $500 or so.

A second question would be if you already have a quality camera you want to use? If it is a full frame sensor, then legacy finite optics meant for full frame optics can be excellent. If you don't yet have a camera, you might consider something in the range from a 1" Sony Sensor and C-mount up to a mirrorless APS-C and direct projection with an "infinity" system.

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75RR
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#5 Post by 75RR » Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:32 am

.
Based on my research thus far I have the impression Motic microscopes are the only affordable microscopes (purchased new) for hobbyists/photomicrographers.
Unless one has a budget of thousands, in microscopy, new is not better.
Zeiss Standard WL (somewhat fashion challenged) & Wild M8
Olympus E-P2 (Micro Four Thirds Camera)

apochronaut
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#6 Post by apochronaut » Wed Dec 01, 2021 3:31 pm

If one zeroes in on optical quality as their prime reason for choosing a microscope, then what is being savid is that the illumination/ lens systems are the most important features, required. If one wants to capture that optical quality, then the camera can be added to those features as an adjunct but any camera can be adapted in one way or another to work on any microscope, so the microscope brand is irrelevant to the camera choice in general. I recognize that certain adaptions are easier though.

Any microscope can be outfitted with an excellent quality illumination/lens corridor. It could be a frame made of glued popsicle sticks but it could still be fitted with a superior illumination and optical system than any off the shelf $2,000.00 microscope.

Motic, as one of the better recognized Chinese brands uses similar planachro optics to those of other brands but Motic is still bound by the economics of today and is thus bound to make a stand that utilizes metal and plastics engineering consistent with those economics and similar in construction quality to similar other brands. A microscope, irregardless of brand from 30 years ago is very very likely to be better built, more precise and last longer ; as long as it is in peak shape when acquired. In the $2,000.00 price category, one should expect that from a used microscope. It is irrefutable that one can buy a used microscope stand of far higher quality for less money : than any new Motic or other Chinese brand and certainly at the same price point.

What about the optics?
Motic is one Chinese maker that actively profiles the availabilty of higher colour corrected optics. Other brands, sometimes make available the 4 objective series of PlanF optics that are floating around but they are not generally promoted because at around 1500.00+ condenser a set, they immediately make any Chinese stand too expensive for almost anyone that might otherwise be interested. Motic, as the flagship Chinese brand can put out a $2000.00 planachro scope with an abbe condenser but once those planachros become PlanF or Planapos plus the needed achromat condenser , you now have an at least $4000.00 microscope but the same average grade stand as other brands.

Highly colour corrected optics for any of the used brands, while not always available right now or in abundance, can be had for much less and installed on a much cheaper but better stand and if one is looking to use a microscope of better optical quality, that is the economical way to go. I doubt if one could go that route in a Chinese microscope for much less than $4000.00 but I have known many examples personally, that vary from around 400.00 for a research stand carrying 4 apochromats to a research stand carrying 3 planapos and 3 planfluors plus 4 phase objectives for about 1750.00. In between those extremes there are all kinds of examples. I am just saying that one need not pay a fortune in a used microscope to acquire a microscope with stellar optics.

One area where the Chinese industry has excelled is in providing an increased f.o.v. Most used scopes, outside of a few with highly prized heads objectives and oculars, will likely be 20mm f.o.v. or even a little less, whereas the default for the better Chinese scopes is quickly becoming 22mm. That matters to some users and doesn't to others. I can use both and don't really find 20mm that limiting. China has built up an industry where they can use the same eyepiece fitted with different field stops for various microscopes, because they have basically two infinity optical systems. NIS 45 or 60 and 180mm. Two eyepiece formulas mfg. 75,000 times over each makes for pretty cheap eyepieces, even if they are 22mm f.o.v. or more. You can't fault their efficiency.

Alexander
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#7 Post by Alexander » Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:28 pm

@apochronaut

What you are saying is very true.

My 50 years old Leitz Dialux is of a mechanical build quality no contemporary microscope could match, not even the most expensive ones. It did cost me less than 200 USD initially, including 4 plan objectives and an achromatic condenser. I had it refurbished by a very competent mechanic and upgraded it to my preferences. Looks like new now and works like new. My total investment was about 2000 USD. I got phase contrast, darkfield and epi-fluorescence for that including a large set of pretty nice objectives.

Dubious
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#8 Post by Dubious » Wed Dec 01, 2021 8:50 pm

There are certainly good deals to be had in vintage/used microscopes. However, unless buying from a trusted source, there is also uncertainty that some find it worthwhile to pay more to avoid. I've done it both ways.

farnsy
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#9 Post by farnsy » Sat Dec 04, 2021 2:54 am

I would question how much better the C2 is than something like an AmScope T720 with a quintuple head. Differences would be small unless you get the fluorite objectives.

apochronaut
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Re: Anyone purchased or used the Motic Panthera C2 Microscope?

#10 Post by apochronaut » Mon Dec 06, 2021 2:05 pm

Fluorite or Apochromat optics are game changers for all microscopes. Unless one includes that realization within the concepts of "improved optics" or " better optics" or " optical upgrade", then they are just subbing an orange for a seedless orange. Once one does, they are then subbing an orange for a diverse citrus platter containing oranges, grapefruits, satsumas, tangelos, pomelos etc. etc.
Even relatively basic and spartan microscope stands become optical beasts capable of imaging at previously un-thought of heights.

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