Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

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erikwetterskog
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Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#1 Post by erikwetterskog » Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:37 pm

Hello,

I have been offered a couple of objectives, for what I think is a good price. I have two stands, a Nikon E400 and an Olympus CX41 (w. epi fluroescence).

I have been offered to buy the following: Zeiss Plan-NEOFLUAR 100x/1.30 oil Ph3 Phase Contrast Objective

(for a lot less than in the above link). Will this objective work and be parfocal on my Olympus CX41? I know Nikon and Olympus have different parfocal lengths. I only have a Plan Achro w/o phase contrast for the Olympus. Are the Ph3-rings the same size for all makers? I have an Olympus phase condenser.

I read somewhere that Zeiss infinity still has some eyepiece correction, is this true? Seems odd to me? I would like to buy it, but it seems impractical to use a 100x that is not parfocal with the 4 others.

In addition, I was also offered to buy: Zeiss Epiplan-NEOFLUAR 100x /1.30 Oil POL Polarization Microscope

It seems like a pretty cool objective, but I do not understand the "use-case". It is an EPI (metallurgical) objective, for 0 coverglass thickness. Yet, it is an oil immersion objective requiring you to soak whatever you are looking at straight in oil. Does anybody know what this was used for? Petrography (my guess since it is especially for polarized light)? I don't have regular-EPI illumination though, only FL.

I was also offered this objective::Nikon BD Plan 100X DIC NA 0.9 Dry 210/0

What is the use case for this (metallurical)? Will it work on an infinity stand like the E400?
Nikon S-Ke - Old goodie
Olympus CX40 - Fluorescence [Selling]
Olympus BX61 - Phase contrast, DIC, fluorescence [Work-in-progress]

Alexander
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#2 Post by Alexander » Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:01 pm

erikwetterskog wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:37 pm

I would like to buy it, but it seems impractical to use a 100x that is not parfocal with the 4 others.
This "problem" is widely over-rated. I never seen someone putting oil on the slide then turning the nose-piece. The oil would be moved to the side and produce a mess. Everybody using immersion objectives I know puts the oil on the slide then uses the focus knobs to close in. Even with my setup of all oil-immersion objectives on the nose-piece I follow that procedure when changing objectives. Increase distance until the oil-film breaks then turn to the other objective and close in again.

Leitzcycler
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#3 Post by Leitzcycler » Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:48 pm

I always put oil on the slide and then turn the nose piece. Just some fine-focusing after that. No mess at all. :) Though I think the other way is more professional, I have found this quick and easy and most comfortable for me.

Dennis
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#4 Post by Dennis » Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:25 pm

I tried oil for the first time today.
I put on the cover slip top then turned the turret back.
I used what I had- some olive oil. I did not become a fan.
Cloudy look and whole time I was worried about getting oil on places on microscope.
I never could get focused view through cloudy mirk.
It didn't work out. I did 50X oil objective. Fed up with it now.
I really only want to that level for Amoebas. 40X still okay for Amoeba but doesn't get in too close.

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imkap
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#5 Post by imkap » Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:43 pm

erikwetterskog wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:37 pm
Are the Ph3-rings the same size for all makers? I have an Olympus phase condenser.
I think they aren't compatible with Olympus condenser, but never tried this combination so not sure.
I also think Zeiss does corrections in tube lens in infinity systems, I think you can search around a bit and find an answer to this.

You should try before you buy, or if the price is that good take the risk and sell on if you don't like.
Still the price when buying sometimes looks better than when you want to sell.

Scarodactyl
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#6 Post by Scarodactyl » Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:44 pm

erikwetterskog wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:37 pm
Will this objective work and be parfocal on my Olympus CX41?
Work? Ish, but higher end zeiss infinity objectives require tube lens (not eyepiece) corrections. You won't get great results. Better to get an Olympus objective or one of the many compatible clones (which include objectives from the Zeiss primostar which is made by Motic).
Dennis wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:25 pm
I tried oil for the first time today.
I put on the cover slip top then turned the turret back.
I used what I had- some olive oil. I did not become a fan.
Cloudy look and whole time I was worried about getting oil on places on microscope.
No offense, but this is not the correct way to use an oil objective so of course it did not give good results. Doing something wrong isn't a good basis for judging its merits. Immersion microscopy is amazing when done correctly, of even incorrectly within appropriate tolerances as I usually do.

Dennis
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#7 Post by Dennis » Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:18 pm

I was not judging its merits as I know OTHERS do it with correct oil and do have good results.
Apparently too much for me to bother with.

Scarodactyl
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#8 Post by Scarodactyl » Tue Nov 22, 2022 2:15 am

It's worth spending a little bit to get the right oil and gove it a try. It's a really cool experience.

Dennis
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#9 Post by Dennis » Tue Nov 22, 2022 5:12 am

Scarodactyl,
I was thinking afterward-
You are right.

erikwetterskog
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#10 Post by erikwetterskog » Tue Nov 22, 2022 6:45 am

Thanks for the answers. I will save my money then.

It is absolutely not worth getting a Neofluar Ph3 if it is not going going to perform as intented. I already have a Plan Achro Ph3 for the Nikon. It is a pi ty, the objectives are almost new and well-priced.

Olive oil has a refractive index of ~1.48, too low. The worst part of it is probably the free acids which will corrode the lens-barell. It is also contains mono- and some polyunsaturated fatty acids that are prone to oxidation (hardening, photodegradation). So over all a funny choice! Olive oil also has a lot of autofluorescence.

Regarding the 100x oil, I'm not at all surprised that people use oil objectives. I'm only suprised that there where dedicated high resolution-EPI-objectives that require the use of oil. I would imagine that if you work with polished metal alloys or the like that it would suck to contaminate them with oil (I'm a material chemist). But maybe that is the price you pay to do awesome polarization studies at high resolution?
Nikon S-Ke - Old goodie
Olympus CX40 - Fluorescence [Selling]
Olympus BX61 - Phase contrast, DIC, fluorescence [Work-in-progress]

Scarodactyl
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Re: Questions about Zeiss objectives on a Olympus microscope

#11 Post by Scarodactyl » Tue Nov 22, 2022 3:44 pm

The increase in resolution over a typical 100x/0.95 dry objective is very significant, though they're not too common and water immersion is sometimes used as a compromise. Really there's not much reason to use one over a normal oil objective since the oil's RI is close to the coverslip glass so it doesn't care much if glass is present or absent.

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