Hi,
I've seen in a local board a very good deal on a (like new) Nikon Eclipse Ci-L stand, just the stand with nothing else. I'm very tempted to buy it as a 'long term' project, but checking online docs and brochures it seems that the Ci line has not DIC capability, only the Ni line is DIC capable. It's been kind of a surprise that only the research top line of Nikon has that feature.
Anyway, as per the system charts, apparently I see nothing that can prevent to add a dic capable nosepiece with the prism and analyzer, universal condenser with the prisms and polarizer from the Ni to the Ci.
Probably I'm missing something, Do you think that the Ci could be configured for DIC? maybe it's a commercial decision?
DIC on Nikon Eclipse Ci-L
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Scarodactyl
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Re: DIC on Nikon Eclipse Ci-L
On the older E line the E400 was prevented from mounting doc hardware by its geometry. With some grinding into the metal frame one could be mounted (I think Pete demonstrated this in an older thread). It might be a similar situation here.
Re: DIC on Nikon Eclipse Ci-L
As far as I can tell, there are three issues in using one of Nikon's less expensive Eclipse microscopes with transmitted DIC:
1) You need to be able to fit a DIC interchangeable nosepiece. It doesn't look like the Ci-L has either the interchangeable nosepiece fitting, nor the clearance, and probably not the illumination (as in #2) next.
2) There must be sufficient illumination to handle DIC at higher magnifications. That's 100 watts halogen or a LED equivalent.
3) Nikon wants to be sure you pay a lot extra for its DIC systems, figuring that's what the market will bear. For example, the 50i model has the interchangeable nosepiece, but not enough clearance for a turret (and also not enough light). The E400 doesn't have an interchangeable turret fitting - though one can be scavenged from another scope. To prevent this, Nikon added a couple ribs to make sure it wouldn't fit. Those can be machined away, and a bright LED fitted to make an E400 the equivalent of an E600.
On edit: just saw Stephen's post. Yes, there is a thread. The extra aluminum ribs (decorative and obstructive - not needed for strength) were machined away in a milling machine. Judging from appearance, the Ci-L doesn't look to be a candidate for this. First, you'd have to find the interchangeable nosepiece fitting. Second, it looks (like the 50i) to not have enough clearance to fit the larger DIC nosepiece. Third, the light would likely have to be replaced for a brighter LED.
1) You need to be able to fit a DIC interchangeable nosepiece. It doesn't look like the Ci-L has either the interchangeable nosepiece fitting, nor the clearance, and probably not the illumination (as in #2) next.
2) There must be sufficient illumination to handle DIC at higher magnifications. That's 100 watts halogen or a LED equivalent.
3) Nikon wants to be sure you pay a lot extra for its DIC systems, figuring that's what the market will bear. For example, the 50i model has the interchangeable nosepiece, but not enough clearance for a turret (and also not enough light). The E400 doesn't have an interchangeable turret fitting - though one can be scavenged from another scope. To prevent this, Nikon added a couple ribs to make sure it wouldn't fit. Those can be machined away, and a bright LED fitted to make an E400 the equivalent of an E600.
On edit: just saw Stephen's post. Yes, there is a thread. The extra aluminum ribs (decorative and obstructive - not needed for strength) were machined away in a milling machine. Judging from appearance, the Ci-L doesn't look to be a candidate for this. First, you'd have to find the interchangeable nosepiece fitting. Second, it looks (like the 50i) to not have enough clearance to fit the larger DIC nosepiece. Third, the light would likely have to be replaced for a brighter LED.
Re: DIC on Nikon Eclipse Ci-L
The light can be an issue for sure, but shouldn't be an stopper because there are led retrofits already available for the Ci that could address this issue.
About the nosepiece, I'm just making the assumption (I'm not very familiar with Nikon microscopes, I've had only Zeiss and Lomo) that the nosepiece D-ND6 DIC would fit, because it fits the Ni standard arm as the C-N6 and CN6A do, and the C-N6 fits the Eclipse Ci. Maybe as you point there's not enough clearance.
Anyway, I guess I'll pass. Too many unanswered questions. And I'm still puzzled about why nikon has only one line of microscopes with DIC. As far as I know other manufacturers like Zeiss or Olympus offer DIC in several of their product lines.
About the nosepiece, I'm just making the assumption (I'm not very familiar with Nikon microscopes, I've had only Zeiss and Lomo) that the nosepiece D-ND6 DIC would fit, because it fits the Ni standard arm as the C-N6 and CN6A do, and the C-N6 fits the Eclipse Ci. Maybe as you point there's not enough clearance.
Anyway, I guess I'll pass. Too many unanswered questions. And I'm still puzzled about why nikon has only one line of microscopes with DIC. As far as I know other manufacturers like Zeiss or Olympus offer DIC in several of their product lines.
Re: DIC on Nikon Eclipse Ci-L
The DIC nosepiece requires a bit more clearance at the back side - toward the "arm" of the stand. The 50i doesn't have this. Judging by photos, the Ci-L probably doesn't. For the E400 I'm pretty sure Nikon added flanges purely to prevent fitting an interchangeable receiver and a DIC nosepiece.
In addition, the lower end of Nikon Eclipse scopes has fixed (screwed in place) nosepiece fittings. For example, the E200 and the E400. It's not entirely clear from pictures, but the Ci-L may also have a fixed nosepiece. This was also true for the Olympus BX40, though a pricey adapter was available.
The huge and mostly unavoidable (besides patience and luck) cost of Nikon DIC is in the prisms. You'll want two or three of them in the condenser and perhaps five or six in the nosepiece. At current eBay and used scope seller prices, these can be around $5000+ for the lot. The C-CU condenser, bare of prisms, is also somewhat pricey - say $700. Add in five or six Plan Fluor or Plan Apo objectives ($3000?), a trinocular head ($650?) and a polarizer/analyzer set -- and the stand and illuminator ($1000?) are only part of the cost. All that said, Nikon infinity DIC is pretty spectacular.
As with Nikon, neither Olympus (CX vs. BX) nor Leica (none of the DM scopes below something like DM2000) offer DIC in their lower-cost microscopes. Same thing with Zeiss Primo (made for Zeiss by Motic) and perhaps other moderately-priced Zeiss infinity scopes.
It's probably only going to get worse, given moves like Olympus' sale of its microscope business to a private equity fund. The good news is that there are a number of excellent used systems from Leica, Nikon, Olympus, Reichert, and Zeiss still around - sometimes affordably. The Chinese DIC scopes are also getting very close in quality with prices still in the $10K plus range for a fully optioned systems.
In addition, the lower end of Nikon Eclipse scopes has fixed (screwed in place) nosepiece fittings. For example, the E200 and the E400. It's not entirely clear from pictures, but the Ci-L may also have a fixed nosepiece. This was also true for the Olympus BX40, though a pricey adapter was available.
The huge and mostly unavoidable (besides patience and luck) cost of Nikon DIC is in the prisms. You'll want two or three of them in the condenser and perhaps five or six in the nosepiece. At current eBay and used scope seller prices, these can be around $5000+ for the lot. The C-CU condenser, bare of prisms, is also somewhat pricey - say $700. Add in five or six Plan Fluor or Plan Apo objectives ($3000?), a trinocular head ($650?) and a polarizer/analyzer set -- and the stand and illuminator ($1000?) are only part of the cost. All that said, Nikon infinity DIC is pretty spectacular.
As with Nikon, neither Olympus (CX vs. BX) nor Leica (none of the DM scopes below something like DM2000) offer DIC in their lower-cost microscopes. Same thing with Zeiss Primo (made for Zeiss by Motic) and perhaps other moderately-priced Zeiss infinity scopes.
It's probably only going to get worse, given moves like Olympus' sale of its microscope business to a private equity fund. The good news is that there are a number of excellent used systems from Leica, Nikon, Olympus, Reichert, and Zeiss still around - sometimes affordably. The Chinese DIC scopes are also getting very close in quality with prices still in the $10K plus range for a fully optioned systems.