Leitz/Leica Labovert DIC/ICT

[Rorschach]

Hello,

Does anyone know what exactly look like the DIC/ICT system parts for a Labovert? I am considering a Leitz/Leica (it has both labels on it, so early 90ies I guess) Labovert that seems to have two of the necessary sliders (that go in below the nosepiece), a polarizer slide of some kind that slots under the trinocular (I suppose) and the correct looking universal condenser which seems to have at least one prism. Please see the photos:

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[Rorschach]

More pics here:

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Labovert2.jpg (46.02 KiB) Viewed 465 times

Labovert3.jpg (57.62 KiB) Viewed 465 times

Labovert4.jpg (137.13 KiB) Viewed 465 times

Labovert5.jpg (65.35 KiB) Viewed 465 times

[wabutter]

It appears you have the required componnents for DIC The Polarizer, Analyser and the objective prism for the 25X L on the slider. It appears the condenser has a matching prism for the 25x (S25) as well? If so, it is complete for DIC on that one objective.

[Rorschach]

It appears you have the required componnents for DIC The Polarizer, Analyser and the objective prism for the 25X L on the slider. It appears the condenser has a matching prism for the 25x (S25) as well? If so, it is complete for DIC on that one objective.

Thanks Wayne, helpful as ever Yes, the condenser does seem to have the 25x prism. Strangely though, no prism for the 40x. The DIC for these was marketed as having objectives and prisms for 25x and 40x. Please see the attached pic on Labovert brochure text on ICT and polarization.

Labovert_brochure_text_on_ICT_and_polarization.jpg (95.81 KiB) Viewed 399 times

I did see a photo of a Labovert DIC scope which had a rotable slider in the slot above the condenser. That one this scope does not seem to have but I am not sure what capability is lost in this case.

Also, in a Labovert brochure there was this strange condenser part that I don't recognise, please see the attached photo. Perhaps it is related to something else, not DIC, though.

Labovert_condenser_part.jpg (42.78 KiB) Viewed 401 times

Despite furious searching, I have been unable to find the user manual for the Leitz or Leica Labovert. Only a brochure could be found

[Rorschach]

The seller has then provided many photos of what looks like maybe two different prisms in the condenser turret. However, I can't verify what exactly the other prism(s) are, the seller isn't 'in the know', and, outside the red 'S 25', there are no other stickers/markings on the outer condenser turret ring.

[owl_capone]

I have a Fluovert with DIC/ICT working on the L25 Fluotar and L40 Fluotar. Afaik in this version the condensor only needs the single S25 (Schnittweite 25mm - 25mm working distance) prism and then the objective-side prism sliders for each respective objective. In practice you can also just use either the L25 or the L40 objective-side prism for both, at least through the eyepieces there's no big difference - I guess the low aperture of the LWD objectives plays a role here.
Also Phaco/non-Phaco for the objectives doesn't matter, it works with both.
Unfortunately so far it also only works with thise two as they have comparable positions of the back focal plane matching the prism. At least I haven't found other objectives in my stash of Leitz lenses that give a DIC effect with that setup.
Once I'm back home on sunday I can take some pictures of my setup.
In short you need: a 'fat' polarizer slider for the illumination slot at the top, condnsor with the required prism(s) (one for 25mm WD, more for other versions afaik), 'certified' objective (Fluotar L40 and Fluotar L25), objective-side prism (L40 or L25) and the slim ICT /polarizer slider for the nosepiece filter slot.
That last one can be flipped for normal DIC or color DIC with a sandwiched lambda plate.

A long time ago a Labovert with DIC was sold in the german forum that, in addition to the L25 and L40 Fluotars had a 10x Fluotar with the build-in wollaston prisms that Leitz used for their ICT system up until the Aristoplan. From then on the prisms moved into a seperate revolver in the nosepiece. Not that dissimilar to how it was done for the Labovert...
That 'scope came from a seller that didn't just plug together a frankenscope and it was stated to work out optcially.

[Rorschach]

I have a Fluovert with DIC/ICT working on the L25 Fluotar and L40 Fluotar. Afaik in this version the condensor only needs the single S25 (Schnittweite 25mm - 25mm working distance) prism and then the objective-side prism sliders for each respective objective. In practice you can also just use either the L25 or the L40 objective-side prism for both, at least through the eyepieces there's no big difference - I guess the low aperture of the LWD objectives plays a role here.
Also Phaco/non-Phaco for the objectives doesn't matter, it works with both.
Unfortunately so far it also only works with thise two as they have comparable positions of the back focal plane matching the prism. At least I haven't found other objectives in my stash of Leitz lenses that give a DIC effect with that setup.
Once I'm back home on sunday I can take some pictures of my setup.
In short you need: a 'fat' polarizer slider for the illumination slot at the top, condnsor with the required prism(s) (one for 25mm WD, more for other versions afaik), 'certified' objective (Fluotar L40 and Fluotar L25), objective-side prism (L40 or L25) and the slim ICT /polarizer slider for the nosepiece filter slot.
That last one can be flipped for normal DIC or color DIC with a sandwiched lambda plate.

A long time ago a Labovert with DIC was sold in the german forum that, in addition to the L25 and L40 Fluotars had a 10x Fluotar with the build-in wollaston prisms that Leitz used for their ICT system up until the Aristoplan. From then on the prisms moved into a seperate revolver in the nosepiece. Not that dissimilar to how it was done for the Labovert...
That 'scope came from a seller that didn't just plug together a frankenscope and it was stated to work out optcially.

Hello 'Owl'

Thanks a lot! This info is very reassuring! Perhaps I can get by without a L40 objective prism, at least for starters. And maybe not that much need to worry about whether the condenser turret has the 40x prism or not But does your info also mean, that I am missing one of the sliders?

[owl_capone]

Nope, maybe my phrasing was a bit too convoluted
The thing in your third picture is the polarizer for the illumination side. In the Labovert the upper arm carries the illumination pathway as well as the image going into the head.

You can see some of the internal layout in the patent https://patentimages.storage.googleapis ... 619503.pdf.
Nice and complicated light routing that as rumours have it was very time consuming to adjust at the factory. Unfortunately for Leitz the Labovert seemed to be very popular for ergonomic reasons - the sample is right under your nose same as with a traditional upright. So the model stuck around for quite some time hence why you see them both with Leitz and Leica branding.

[Rorschach]

Nope, maybe my phrasing was a bit too convoluted
The thing in your third picture is the polarizer for the illumination side. In the Labovert the upper arm carries the illumination pathway as well as the image going into the head.

You can see some of the internal layout in the patent https://patentimages.storage.googleapis ... 619503.pdf.
Nice and complicated light routing that as rumours have it was very time consuming to adjust at the factory. Unfortunately for Leitz the Labovert seemed to be very popular for ergonomic reasons - the sample is right under your nose same as with a traditional upright. So the model stuck around for quite some time hence why you see them both with Leitz and Leica branding.

Ok, excellent! It seems the scope is set to go then! I've seen photos of Laboverts with an adjustable polarizer in the upper slot but maybe that doesn't have anything to do with DIC.

When you have the time, it'd be great to see pics of your setup and the details of it

[apochronaut]

It appears you have the required componnents for DIC The Polarizer, Analyser and the objective prism for the 25X L on the slider. It appears the condenser has a matching prism for the 25x (S25) as well? If so, it is complete for DIC on that one objective.

Also, in a Labovert brochure there was this strange condenser part that I don't recognise, please see the attached photo. Perhaps it is related to something else, not DIC, though.

Labovert_condenser_part.jpg

Despite furious searching, I have been unable to find the user manual for the Leitz or Leica Labovert. Only a brochure could be found

I think, a supplemental condenser lens for very low power wide field objectives?

[Rorschach]

It appears you have the required componnents for DIC The Polarizer, Analyser and the objective prism for the 25X L on the slider. It appears the condenser has a matching prism for the 25x (S25) as well? If so, it is complete for DIC on that one objective.

Also, in a Labovert brochure there was this strange condenser part that I don't recognise, please see the attached photo. Perhaps it is related to something else, not DIC, though.

Labovert_condenser_part.jpg

Despite furious searching, I have been unable to find the user manual for the Leitz or Leica Labovert. Only a brochure could be found

I think, a supplemental condenser lens for very low power wide field objectives?

Yeah, probably. This scope doesn't have it, though. Yet there is a 4x objective. Finding the supplemental lens on eevilbay or elsewhere may prove near impossible.

[apochronaut]

Supplemental condenser lenses lead double lives and end up in strange places. My best acquisition of a needed one was from ebay and came complete with it's 1.4 achromat aplanat condenser. I picked it up on a Sunday morning and had to wait a while because the seller who looked like Keith Moon, especially in haircut, was just returning from a gig. He was a drummer in a Who tribute band but moonlighted (literally) as a member of a dumpster diver co-op, which was the source for the condenser. They had a brick and mortar storefront too!

[Rorschach]

Supplemental condenser lenses lead double lives and end up in strange places. My best acquisition of a needed one was from ebay and came complete with it's 1.4 achromat aplanat condenser. I picked it up on a Sunday morning and had to wait a while because the seller who looked like Keith Moon, especially in haircut, was just returning from a gig. He was a drummer in a Who tribute band but moonlighted (literally) as a member of a dumpster diver co-op, which was the source for the condenser. They had a brick and mortar storefront too!

What a story! No way I'll be able to one-up that

[Rorschach]

The Labovert comes with a Leitz 10x/0.25 Plan star objective, which is DIC compatible according to what I have read. So, perhaps also this one will work with the one 25x DIC prism. This is of course just an extrapolation from owl capones experiences.