HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

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zacharch
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HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#1 Post by zacharch » Sat Jun 13, 2020 6:05 pm

Hi all,

At my wits ends trying to find a tool to help center my objective lenses on my Nikon Optiphot. Screws look like they need (basically) a hex socket, at about 1mm (can't actually measure - my calipers are to wide to fit inside the recessed space). This kind of socket apparently doesn't exist. Tried (and failed) to use a 1mm hex machine screw, but the cap is too wide.

Any recommendations where I can get this tool, or what I might use instead? Is it expensive (it shouldn't be...)? Ebay is no help, ifixit is no help. At this point desperate.
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Hobbyst46
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#2 Post by Hobbyst46 » Sat Jun 13, 2020 6:44 pm

Have you seen this very recent post
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9617

Leitzcycler
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#3 Post by Leitzcycler » Sat Jun 13, 2020 6:50 pm

Never used Nikon. However, I would first try an inch size wrench. As you probably know there are two series of hex keys. One for metric sizes and one for inch sizes. Both sets of keys may be bought a low price at local hardware store.

zacharch
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#4 Post by zacharch » Sat Jun 13, 2020 6:57 pm

Missed this post completely! Thanks Hobbyst, I'll try the watchkeys - looks like amazon has them for pretty cheap. I'll update the post once I try it.

Leitzcycler
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#5 Post by Leitzcycler » Sat Jun 13, 2020 7:01 pm

Can't see the photo very clearly. But isn't it a female screw? At least the non-circulated screw looks like female which would need male wrench?

Leitzcycler
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#6 Post by Leitzcycler » Sat Jun 13, 2020 7:45 pm

Tried (and failed) to use a 1mm hex machine screw, but the cap is too wide.
So the circulated screw head must be male. Sorry, I didn't realize this at first.

MichaelG.
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#7 Post by MichaelG. » Sat Jun 13, 2020 8:58 pm

zacharch wrote:
Sat Jun 13, 2020 6:57 pm
Missed this post completely! Thanks Hobbyst, I'll try the watchkeys - […]
I don’t think that will get you very far ... Watch keys fit squares

The original idea in that thread could probably be adapted though, by using a hex key to make the broach.

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MichaelG.
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#8 Post by MichaelG. » Sat Jun 13, 2020 9:40 pm

Section 5. on page 9 of this manual has me thoroughly confused:
https://lavinia.as.arizona.edu/~mtuell/ ... ctions.pdf

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Leitzcycler
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#9 Post by Leitzcycler » Sun Jun 14, 2020 4:41 am

The original idea in that thread could probably be adapted though, by using a hex key to make the broach
:D

JWW
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#10 Post by JWW » Sun Jun 14, 2020 4:45 am

I tried using a gum eraser pushed into the bore. Best I could measure it across the hexagonal flat was 0.050". I don't have a wire EDM machine and wouldn't know how to operate it if I did.

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-JW:

Leitzcycler
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#11 Post by Leitzcycler » Sun Jun 14, 2020 4:50 am

Tried (and failed) to use a 1mm hex machine screw, but the cap is too wide.
How about narrowing the outer diameter of the screw? If you don't have a lathe, you could try to fit the screw into a drilling machine and use a file. And get some heat :)

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#12 Post by JWW » Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:01 am

Maybe (note the maybe) you could make something similar to this. It's for my PZO Biolar DIC condenser. Obviously to be fabricated with the proper diameter for the bore and slot to span two opposite flats.
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MichaelG.
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#13 Post by MichaelG. » Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:15 am

Leitzcycler wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 4:50 am
Tried (and failed) to use a 1mm hex machine screw, but the cap is too wide.
How about narrowing the outer diameter of the screw? […]
If, as indicated by JWW the hex is actually, 0.050” it may even be easier than that
... The caps of Imperial screws have more elegant proportions than Metric ones
[ some useful numbers in these tables: http://www.csgnetwork.com/screwsochdcaptable.html ]

MichaelG.

.

Edit: This page has a chart which includes the smaller metric sizes:
https://practicalmaintenance.net/?p=386
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Hobbyst46
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#14 Post by Hobbyst46 » Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:11 am

1. There are female allen keys on eBay, although their external diameter seems to be excessive, and must be reduced
2. Although not perfect, a female key with at least 2 parallel surfaces might suffice in this case, since it is centration rather than tightening of the screws, so the improvised square keys created by Leitzcycler might actually work fine.

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#15 Post by MichaelG. » Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:54 am

Hobbyst46 wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:11 am
1. […]
2. Although not perfect, a female key with at least 2 parallel surfaces might suffice in this case, since it is centration rather than tightening of the screws, so the improvised square keys created by Leitzcycler might actually work fine.
Sorry, but it seems impractical [most probably impossible] to usefully fit a hexagon inside a square.

But, as I wrote yesterday:
The original idea in that thread could probably be adapted though, by using a hex key to make the broach.
.
MichaelG.
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Hobbyst46
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#16 Post by Hobbyst46 » Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:00 am

MichaelG. wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:54 am
Sorry, but it seems impractical [most probably impossible] to usefully fit a hexagon inside a square.
Oops, my total folly on Sunday morning :o :lol: y!!!

hans
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#17 Post by hans » Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:33 am

If the heads are 1.5 mm, slightly larger than JWW's measurement, it looks like that is the smallest common nut driver size, for example:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/ ... 31-1438-ND
https://www.mcmaster.com/52965A22

Charles
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#18 Post by Charles » Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:08 pm

The square drive watch winders should work. They are fairly inexpensive and most are sold in sets of varying sizes. All you need is a size which will contact three or even two sides of the hex. You don't need much force as you are not tightening or loosening the lug. You could probably turn it with tweezers or even small hemostats.

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#19 Post by BramHuntingNematodes » Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:36 pm

Since torque requirements are low, plaster casting in aluminum is probably a sufficient method for fabricating a key.
1942 Bausch and Lomb Series T Dynoptic, Custom Illumination

MichaelG.
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#20 Post by MichaelG. » Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:02 pm

Charles wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:08 pm
The square drive watch winders should work. […] All you need is a size which will contact three or even two sides of the hex.
As per my previous comment to Hobbyst46 : I struggle with that geometry
... This is the best fit of which I am aware:
https://undergroundmathematics.org/thin ... 8/solution

[ or are you suggesting offsetting the axes ? ]

I would much rather adapt a suitable hex-socket cap-head screw to serve as a driver.

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Roldorf
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#21 Post by Roldorf » Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:40 pm

A T4 torx wrench is .053 inches across the points so all you need is a T4 torx screw.

Edit: See here for sizes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torx
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zacharch
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#22 Post by zacharch » Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:48 pm

Charles wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:08 pm
The square drive watch winders should work. They are fairly inexpensive and most are sold in sets of varying sizes. All you need is a size which will contact three or even two sides of the hex. You don't need much force as you are not tightening or loosening the lug. You could probably turn it with tweezers or even small hemostats.
Tried the cheap amazon square keys this morning, and the problem is that the key itself is too large for the holes. Might try to sand down the outside, see if that works.

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#23 Post by JWW » Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:55 pm

Well I gave this a shot this morning. The smallest allen head screw I had required a 2mm allen wrench. I had to turn down the head to 3.22mm so it would fit in the bore of the turret. Unfortunately the allen key in the turrent isn't 2mm, so I'll assume that my original measurement was correct at 1.27mm (0.050").
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#24 Post by MichaelG. » Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:01 pm

JWW wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:55 pm
Well I gave this a shot this morning. The smallest allen head screw I had required a 2mm allen wrench. I had to turn down the head to 3.22mm so it would fit in the bore of the turret. Unfortunately the allen key in the turrent isn't 2mm, so I'll assume that my original measurement was correct at 1.27mm (0.050").
From the table I linked earlier, that should mean you need to find a #0 Unified screw

... Nice job though.

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#25 Post by JWW » Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:22 pm

... bet that will be interesting to find. Probably have to buy a 100.

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#26 Post by MichaelG. » Tue Jun 16, 2020 5:29 am

MichaelG. wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:01 pm
JWW wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:55 pm
... so I'll assume that my original measurement was correct at 1.27mm (0.050").
From the table I linked earlier, that should mean you need to find a #0 Unified screw
.

or alternatively, start with a countersunk screw
[which uses a smaller size key than the cap-head]
Unbrako lists #1 and #2 as having 0.050” recess

see p43 : http://www.unbrako.com/images/downloads ... _Guide.pdf

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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#27 Post by JWW » Tue Jun 16, 2020 11:17 pm

... farted around with this again today with no success. :roll: I found a 0.050" Allen Cap Screw at ACE Hardware. Unfortunately I only bought one. Physically viewing the end hex it appears to be the same size as the male key in the turret. I even made another mold of it with a kneaded eraser, photographed it with my cell phone along with a scale and measured it in ImageJ. Not super accurate but pretty darn close. It sure looks like a male 0.050" hex in the turret. Instead of machining something again I used a aluminum bit holder I had figuring it would work. It worked but I couldn't get the cap screw to work. I thought that maybe I needed to turn the diameter down a hair but my lathe chuck wouldn't go small enough to grip the threaded side of the cap screw. So I put it in my aluminum bit holder and chucked that up. I took a couple super light cuts but on the third cut if flew out and I lost it. Like I said in the beginning, I only purchased one (65 cents). I also purchased a 2mm keyed one and it didn't work.

... getting tired of farting around.

-JW:
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#28 Post by MichaelG. » Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:02 am

.

I feel your pain, JW !

More later ...

MichaelG.

[ Just woken up in the middle of the night, I should be asleep ]
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#29 Post by Roldorf » Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:02 am

Use a file instead of a cutting tool, much less torque.
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Re: HELP: Missing centering tool for Nikon Optiphot objectives

#30 Post by MichaelG. » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:38 am

MichaelG. wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:02 am
More later ...
.

Your ‘forensic’ technique is admirable, JW ... but there is an [unquantifiable] risk that the rubber you are using to take your impression will ‘spring back’

Your results do look convincingly like 0.050” but the reason I mention this is that one of the preferred sizes for Metric hex keys is 1.3mm, and I am not entirely convinced that a 30micron difference will be detectable without physical access to the Nikon nosepiece component.

You will be doing a great service to the community if you can identify the correct size ... so please persevere !

MichaelG.
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